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"Yes means yes" - I have some doubts
#1
"Yes means yes" - I have some doubts
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I'm sure you have all heard of this and the overall message is something I agree with - Someone who is drunk, high, unconscious, or coerced but doesn't say "no" can be raped and it should legally recognized as such.

However I have a problem with the extent of "yes means yes" - So how far do we take it? Is engaging in consensual sexual activity that can be justified trough body language enough to consent? Is it rape if one party never says no but undoubtedly has actions that lead the other end to believe it is consented (like taking of clothes or displaying affection)?

I'm sorry feminists, I support many of your causes but I think you should redefine this message of "yes means yes" because it can easily be used as a mean to ruin the other person's life.

Two relevant personal examples (includes non explicit description of my sex life) that break this rule:

1 - Me and my SO frequently don't say "yes" or "no" when we start foreplaying, our body language and overall excitement is enough to realize that we both are consenting. There's no need to ask frequently or anytime at all something like "are you enjoying this? Do you want me to keep going", unless there's a specific sign that one of us doesn't want it, something we are both able to recognize (trough noticing lack of comfort, lack of body reactions that mean "I want this", etc.)

2 - Sometimes she says "no" and I keep going. Ok calm down I'm not a rapist Tongue Sometimes what we are doing is so nice, that she says "no" or "stop" as a way of saying "This is so good and if you keep going I'm going to have an orgasm", or "this is so good that I'm going to pass out of so much pleasure", or "I am physically unable to hold so many positive physical and psychological feelings in my body at the same time" - But yeah, her "no" doesn't actually mean "no", it's a sign for a "yes". Alternatively, a "maybe" can mean "yes" or "no"; usually when she says "maybe", it means almost all the times a "yes" but more provocative.

So where do we stay at with the whole consent thing?

Final note - I am against any kind of sex assault, whether it involves penetration or not, as long as it's not consented - By consent, I interpreted as the lack of any credible and clear sign that the other part wants to have sexual relationships. Providing an example, if A strips B without her saying "yes", and she shows no sings of enjoying it or wanting it, or, on the contrary, shows fear and desperation, then it is rape, even if there wasn't a "no"-
Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you

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#2
RE: "Yes means yes" - I have some doubts
I don't get this. Are they saying you need to formally ask the question, or else it is rape? That is indeed weird. Body language is well known to be much more meaningful than words. Of course I am against any kind of sexual abuse. But I would imagine in the vast majority of consenting sexual encounters the question is not formally asked.

Also, couldn't this be twisted by people, taking it to the point where, "Yes means yes, and no takesies backsies"?

I understand the idea behind it, but it seems Impractical. Is this really a law there?
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