Posts: 67172
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 6:06 am
(This post was last modified: March 21, 2015 at 6:07 am by The Grand Nudger.)
The movie is terrible, but as YA fiction (not the intent, but thats where it sits), the book is impressive. Can't blame L Ron for the movie...unfortunately.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 30726
Threads: 2123
Joined: May 24, 2012
Reputation:
71
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 10:00 am
(This post was last modified: March 21, 2015 at 10:02 am by Brian37.)
(March 21, 2015 at 12:49 am)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: Name one work written by Ron Hubbard that has even close to the depth, story and metaphor of even star trek or star wars.
Still not getting it. You don't let anything go as far as claims if you are looking to find the nature of reality. I am not talking about human rights, I am talking about what happens when you don't question. Science can be quite twisted by anyone for any reason.
Hubbard started a religion, and mixed religious memes and science sounding buzz words. If he can do that anyone can and that is how bad logic can lead others off a cliff.
I am dead serious when I say that applies to si fi as well. It should not shock anyone if some deluded nut started a religion based on Star Wars to go into the future to be considered a real religion rather than a si fi fan club. If L. Ron Hubbard can start a religion based on bullshit, so can a Star Wars fan or Star Trek fan.
If you are leaving it at entertainment, fine. But that is you, others can take what should be left at that level and convince others to turn entertainment into a con.
No matter what non lab claim a human makes, never underestimate the ability for cleaver con artists to use anything to convince the gullible.
Posts: 67172
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 10:10 am
So the issue isn't so much with sci fi, as it is with loons and liars? Good luck to you sir, you're going to need to dig alot of holes.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 3289
Threads: 118
Joined: January 19, 2015
Reputation:
30
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 10:41 am
Well I feel a lot safer knowing that Brian is on the case. 
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
Albert Einstein
Posts: 30726
Threads: 2123
Joined: May 24, 2012
Reputation:
71
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 10:41 am
(March 21, 2015 at 10:10 am)Rhythm Wrote: So the issue isn't so much with sci fi, as it is with loons and liars? Good luck to you sir, you're going to need to dig alot of holes.
Yes it is because everything humans do is an act of communication if you are going to treat Si fi differently you are allowing it to potentially be abused like any other act of communication.
Nothing as far as claims should ever be left to their own devices.
Posts: 67172
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 10:52 am
(This post was last modified: March 21, 2015 at 10:59 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Yeah, you know, I managed to read L Rons sci fi without turning into a scientologist. I just don't know that the problem you see actually exists.  hrugs:
We tell stories, sure..some people are nuts, sure....but the former really isn't the origin or source of the latter, eh? Sci fi isn't "claims"......it's fiction, a story, decidedly so and self declared (hell that's kind of why they call it fiction, after all...). Do you think that even the authors feel that they are making some sort of claim, and if so...are you sure that the claim has anything to do with science? Is there a claim, for example, in "A Scanner Darkly" - what is it? Or, just pick something you prefer, something you're familiar with....tell me the sorts of claims you see?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 30726
Threads: 2123
Joined: May 24, 2012
Reputation:
71
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 11:02 am
(March 21, 2015 at 10:41 am)AFTT47 Wrote: Well I feel a lot safer knowing that Brian is on the case.
Please, why is everyone flipping out over a very simple statement. Dont take anyone's word for it, not even me. In laypersons terms "You know what happens when you assume, it makes an ass out of u and me."
If you are not applying that to science fiction, you are making the same mistake humans make with political ideology and religious ideology. I think it is never a good idea to go "that sounds nice" and do nothing to test it.
Again, you are allowing your evolutionary sense of fair play override the pragmatic side of how we gain a better understanding of all this. If we can use fucked up logic as a species on other issues, how do you think si fi is immune to that flaw?
Again, human rights is not my issue. "Don't assume" is pragmatic, nowhere is that saying "never".
There is a way to go about finding knowledge and a way not to. Anything outside that is nothing until testing acts on it. So not even with me, you do not have to take my word for it either.
Posts: 67172
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 11:11 am
(This post was last modified: March 21, 2015 at 11:17 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Why do you think that's even applicable? Personally, I think theres plenty of knowledge to be found in sci fi (any genre, really)......very little to none of which has anything to do with science, or any claims about science. Sci fi, as a genre...is a setting for human drama...you understand that right?
-To use an example already in the thread....that the pigs in animal farm talk is irrelevant....what they say, is the reason that they talk.......it's not a claim about talking pigs..know what I mean?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 30726
Threads: 2123
Joined: May 24, 2012
Reputation:
71
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 11:17 am
(March 21, 2015 at 11:11 am)Rhythm Wrote: Why do you think that's even applicable? Personally, I think theres plenty of knowledge to be found in sci fi (any genre, really)......very little to none of which has anything to do with science, or any claims about science. Sci fi, as a genre...is a setting for human drama...you understand that right?
ARGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG,
No, you do not simply utter something and do nothing. If it worked like that everything would be true by default. That is where humans go wrong with everything that comes out of their mouths. You have to test things to prove them.
Posts: 19789
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: A Si Fi watchmaker.
March 21, 2015 at 11:19 am
You, sir, are a fanatic.
|
