Critical thought is hard

[Neo-Scholastic]

You're right, if you zoom out for just a minute and consider the whole universe, then think that an omni God is concerned with us pieces of crud, it should be pretty clear we've got a superiority complex. Or some serious insecurities. We sugar coat reality, so we don't have to face up to it.

In a panentheistic religion, everything is part of God. God is like an octopus and we are merely his sock puppets. We forget we are sock puppets and do not have fun?

Anyway, that possibility cheers me up sometimes.

Not quite. You're thinking of pantheism. Panentheism means that everything comes out of God.

[watchamadoodle]

In a panentheistic religion, everything is part of God. God is like an octopus and we are merely his sock puppets. We forget we are sock puppets and do not have fun?

Anyway, that possibility cheers me up sometimes.

Not quite. You're thinking of pantheism. Panentheism means that everything comes out of God.

Don't make me consult wikipedia!

Panentheism (meaning "all-in-God", from the Ancient Greek πᾶν pân ("all"), ἐν en ("in") and Θεός Theós ("God")) is a belief system which posits that the divine – whether as a single God, number of gods, or other form of "cosmic animating force" – interpenetrates every part of the universe and extends, timelessly (and, presumably, spacelessly) beyond it. Unlike pantheism, which holds that the divine and the universe are identical, panentheism maintains a distinction between the divine and non-divine and the significance of both

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panentheism

So the octopus interpenetrates all us sock puppets with its tentacles and extends timelessly beyond.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Alright, so as some of you know I've only recently been indicted into the atheist world. In between then and now I have consumed vast quantities of atheist/anti-theist/skeptic/philosophical media and believed myself to be smart because I understood the logic and agreed with the conclusions therein. Having gained confidence in my ideals from such affirmation, I thought it high time to test my merits against purely religious media and rented "God's Not Dead" (a video I had prematurely judged to be an inadequate portrayal of philosophical thought based off of reviews I had seen).
In order to fortify my resolve in not taking anything personally, I took several drinks before viewing the film (and perhaps this is where my uncertainty lies but I am fairly sure it is not the underlying cause) and slogged my way through half of it so far (I am reporting directly from my living room couch alongside my ale so I apologize if I missed any spelling errors). My reasoning has not been so effected that I can't tell good logic from bad at my so very mediocre level and yet, knowing full well before going into the movie that the arguments were faulty, I can't help but feel woefully unprepared to defend myself against its onslaught.
I know in my "heart" as well as my mind (the only time the two have even remotely agreed on something) that there is no god, but I feel as if my paper armor I once believed as strong as steel has been chipped away.

Am I wrong? Is it just the drink? Did I expect all arguments from theists to be so convoluted that they'd be simple to undermine and got knocked off my feet when I found out they weren't? Am I just too stupid think beyond what I am told?
All these questions and more have arisen within my mind and seek to throw me off balance, the strongest being that last one.
I need some insight, help, and recommendations for what I can do to improve my thought process. Has anyone gone through what I am going through right now?

It's probably the drink, in large part. Alcohol can and does hamper reasoning.

As for improving your thought process: study plane geometry; it will teach you to manufacture arguments by understanding that any premise often has several key implications, and that seeing the interrelationships of those implications can help guide you to the right answer. Study language, so that you have a deep understanding of the words being used. Question everything you're told, and learn how to research for yourself.

Believe me, it's a lifelong affair, but well worth the effort.

[TruthWorthy]

Alright, so as some of you know I've only recently been indicted into the atheist world. In between then and now I have consumed vast quantities of atheist/anti-theist/skeptic/philosophical media and believed myself to be smart because I understood the logic and agreed with the conclusions therein. Having gained confidence in my ideals from such affirmation, I thought it high time to test my merits against purely religious media and rented "God's Not Dead" (a video I had prematurely judged to be an inadequate portrayal of philosophical thought based off of reviews I had seen).
In order to fortify my resolve in not taking anything personally, I took several drinks before viewing the film (and perhaps this is where my uncertainty lies but I am fairly sure it is not the underlying cause) and slogged my way through half of it so far (I am reporting directly from my living room couch alongside my ale so I apologize if I missed any spelling errors). My reasoning has not been so effected that I can't tell good logic from bad at my so very mediocre level and yet, knowing full well before going into the movie that the arguments were faulty, I can't help but feel woefully unprepared to defend myself against its onslaught.
I know in my "heart" as well as my mind (the only time the two have even remotely agreed on something) that there is no god, but I feel as if my paper armor I once believed as strong as steel has been chipped away.

Am I wrong? Is it just the drink? Did I expect all arguments from theists to be so convoluted that they'd be simple to undermine and got knocked off my feet when I found out they weren't? Am I just too stupid think beyond what I am told?
All these questions and more have arisen within my mind and seek to throw me off balance, the strongest being that last one.
I need some insight, help, and recommendations for what I can do to improve my thought process. Has anyone gone through what I am going through right now?

Hi urlawyer, I've been looking into critical thinking processes over the past couple of days, and found this glossary of critical thinking terms which might prove useful. Check it out here: http://www.criticalthinking.org/pages/gl...-terms/496

[urlawyer]

I appreciate the info guys

[Neo-Scholastic]

Not quite. You're thinking of pantheism. Panentheism means that everything comes out of God.

Don't make me consult wikipedia!  

Panentheism (meaning "all-in-God", from the Ancient Greek πᾶν pân ("all"), ἐν en ("in") and Θεός Theós ("God")) is a belief system which posits that the divine – whether as a single God, number of gods, or other form of "cosmic animating force" – interpenetrates every part of the universe and extends, timelessly (and, presumably, spacelessly) beyond it. Unlike pantheism, which holds that the divine and the universe are identical, panentheism maintains a distinction between the divine and non-divine and the significance of both

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panentheism

So the octopus interpenetrates all us sock puppets with its tentacles and extends timelessly beyond.  

The animating principle, to which the Wiki refers, does not necessarily mean control. Think of Divine Emanation like the sun. It provides the warmth and light to all of Earth’s life, but it doesn’t control or direct the lives of the various creatures.

[Simon Moon]

...my answer is really that I have no hope except for the continued advancement of human society which is only grounded in the inherent curiosity of man.

Are you truly content with that answer?

This seems to be a major difference between the way theist's and atheist's minds work.

You want answers that you are content with. 

I want answers that are true, or likely to be true. Even if they are uncomfortable. 

[Neo-Scholastic]

Are you truly content with that answer?

This seems to be a major difference between the way theist's and atheist's minds work.

You want answers that you are content with. 

I want answers that are true, or likely to be true. Even if they are uncomfortable. 

Discontent sometimes makes you dig deeper for the truth. 

[Iroscato]

This seems to be a major difference between the way theist's and atheist's minds work.

You want answers that you are content with. 

I want answers that are true, or likely to be true. Even if they are uncomfortable. 

Discontent sometimes makes you dig deeper for the truth. 

As I understand it, your belief means that there is an all-encompassing force which pervades the universe and keeps the plates spinning, rather than a fat old man sitting on a cloud eternally battling haemorrhoids, am I correct? Please correct me if I've got it wrong.
Still, I have a question. Why do you feel there has to be an intelligence driving the universe? Why can it not just be a result of natural processes acting out as a result of entropy?

[Simon Moon]

This seems to be a major difference between the way theist's and atheist's minds work.

You want answers that you are content with. 

I want answers that are true, or likely to be true. Even if they are uncomfortable. 

Discontent sometimes makes you dig deeper for the truth. 

I agree. 

What do think is the fuel for scientific inquiry that has lead to every advancement we value? 

It sure wasn't contentment with the answer "god did it".