Deconversion

[themc]

I would like to deconvert, but I don't feel like I can unless it is thoroughly disproved and there are benefits that come with deconverting. I don't mind long, complex responses. As long as you don't call me stupid, it's all good.

I have tried before and come back to religion. How can I STAY an unbeliever once I've deconverted?

[Alex K]

How can converting be a choice like you make it sound? Either you believe it or you don't. Making it work and weighing benefits has nothing to do with it, it's not like switching from Toyota to Chevy. If you sometimes fall inti the believer category, then that's just the way it is - so what, there are more important things to worry about.

But pray tell : why do you want to remain an unbeliever? If you can answer that question you might be a step further.

[Bad Wolf]

The only reason you need to become an atheist and stay one is that all these religious claims have not met their burden of proof which means you are not justified in believing them. Here's a good place to start:

http://wiki.ironchariots.org/index.php?title=Main_Page

[Red Economist]

I would like to deconvert, but I don't feel like I can unless it is thoroughly disproved and there are benefits that come with deconverting. I don't mind long, complex responses. As long as you don't call me stupid, it's all good.

I have tried before and come back to religion. How can I STAY an unbeliever once I've deconverted?

I think you need to think of deconversion as a 'positive' process of discovering and creating new values without religion. Nihilism and existential angst are problems of atheism but not inevitably so if you look at humanistic authors (Erich Fromm is a personal favorite). If you think of atheism as a personal journey rather than a destination and as a means to self-realization and liberation from religious ethics, you will probably go further than simply wanting to disprove god. It's about recognizing that you want to be free rather than being right as the latter implies that you are still afraid of a higher power judging you based on what they think is right. the easiest way to stay an atheist is to enjoy it.

[pocaracas]

I would like to deconvert, but I don't feel like I can unless it is thoroughly disproved and there are benefits that come with deconverting. I don't mind long, complex responses. As long as you don't call me stupid, it's all good.

I have tried before and come back to religion. How can I STAY an unbeliever once I've deconverted?

You can stay an unbeliever if you are concerned about the reality of the world, instead of the "truth" that can be found in some old tome.
Even if that reality overrides your own wishful thinking... even if that reality doesn't care about the fate of any single individual... even if the world is what it is.

How can you believe in any mythology, if you are fully aware of their humble man-made origins?
OH, you're not aware of the origin of most mythologies? Or better, you're only aware of the version that each mythology tells? how convenient for them, huh?
How about the part where those different origins are incoherent? Which to accept, then? The one you've been told to accept all your life, simply due to being born in one particular place in the world? Doesn't sound like a valid reason, to me... but who am I? Just some random internet stranger...

[robvalue]

You can't disprove unfalsifiable claims, that is why religion continues to get away with it. Everything they say cannot be proved wrong. It also cannot be proved right, nor examined in any way at all. When they do make a non-trivial religious claim that can be tested, like "prayer works", then it has always failed to the best of my knowledge. This is because religion relies heavily on the placebo effect and confirmation bias.

All religions do the same thing. They hide behind a wall of "you can't prove me wrong". Whether or not anyone can prove it wrong has no effect on whether it actually is wrong. This is the classic argument from ignorance fallacy. I can claim I have a metaphysical dragon in my garage. No one can prove me wrong. Is it reasonable for anyone else to believe this is true, because it can't be prove wrong?

http://robvalue.wix.com/atheism#!argumen...lity/c1831

The more sensible way to approach things is to only believe things that have good evidence to back them up. Otherwise, to be consistent, you'd have to accept as possibly true any crazy untestable thing anyone ever says. Would you do that?

The question comes down to what is most important to you: what is comfortable, or what is true?

What do you think keeps bringing you back to religion? It doesn't offer anything real that can't be achieved without religion, but depending on where you live everything may be set up in religion's favour. The social aspect is a big thing. This can be replaced, it's just a matter of finding like minded individuals: ones who want to be your friend without the requirement to also share their delusions.

There are many benefits to leaving religion:

1) Freedom from dogma
2) Not being judged by an invisible being
3) You can make your own moral decisions free from religious pressure
4) You can choose your own purpose to life
5) This life becomes more precious because you realize it's probably the only one we will have
6) You will be able to make the best life decisions, because you are more in tune with reality
7) Intellectual honesty; no need to try and defend baseless claims, you can accept that we just don't know everything
8) You can still believe in a non-interacting, deistic god, should you want to, at least to fill the gap while making the transition (if there is a god, the chances of it just happening to be exactly as described in a story book are next to nil)

I don't know what religion you've been involved in, but assuming it's Christianity or Islam, why would you want to worship the gods of those religions? In the bible and the Quran it displays very clearly the evil nature of God. If I thought it was a real thing, I'd want nothing to do with it. The only reason I can think of is fear: fear of being punished, or of losing rewards. But of course these punishments and rewards are just made up, the carrot and stick to keep people in line because there are no rational arguments to use.

I'd advise reading your holy book, from start to finish. It's the quickest way to make an atheist!

[Jericho]

I agree with Rob.

From all the research I have done in the small amount of time that I have identified as an Atheist, it is clear to me that there is absolutely no logical reason to believe that any god (or gods) exist. From what I am getting from your predicament and your post, perhaps taking a more agnostic approach would benefit you. That way, you would never go so far as to claiming that god doesn't exist, since being an agnostic atheist means you don't believe in any god, but you cannot prove for or against the existence of god.

I also suggest reading Rob's wix. I just recently read all of the articles and information that it offers and was able to find exactly what I am as well as the best way to deal with it all. Merely a suggestion. You can find the link in Rob's signature, located directly above this post.

[robvalue]

Wow, thank you Jericho! That really made my day

Much appreciated. I'm really happy it was helpful to you.

[Minimalist]

Study this.






And then, when you're done with that, watch this.

[Longhorn]

Gimme 15 mins and $20 and you're deconverted

no refunds

or promises