Why be good?

[Alex K]

https://youtu.be/7w-g_3pVn5g

[LastPoet]

The main reason why I try to be 'good' is because I wish to do so by philosophy, what others do out of fear of punishment, or after a reward.

I do not count telling modern religionists how stupid they are as a 'bad' way. It would be 'bad' to punch them repeatedly to knock some sense into them, albeit sometimes tempting. I guess the keyboard is mightier than the sword or some shit like that.

Of course Good or Bad are quite subjective. It pertains to a personal god that agrees with oneself.

[pocaracas]

I sense a Randy mixing up long-term natural evolution with short-term societal evolution.
Mankind's high-earned sense of morality makes most people inherently lean towards a peaceful coexistence. But while evolution has equipped us to be peaceful towards our kin, our closer group, the tribe... it fails when applied to the greater group, outside our tribe, outside our religion, outside our kin, outside our country... outside... The others are sacrificial.... that is why there's war and conflict.

Dictators come about when a few powerful people combine their efforts into making a country which conforms to a very specific set of rules that limit greatly the remaining population's freedom. It will also often enforce strict border control. This works when the country is self-sufficient. But, in today's global economy, no country is truly self-sufficient and so any dictatorship tends to become technologically (at least) retarded.
The people also react to the limits imposed on them and, depending on the actual power of the leaders, those reactionaries are either silenced or eventually lead to a revolution deposing the dictatorship. Sometimes, the leaders themselves see the error in their ways and correct it a bit. Anyway, dictatorships always tend to eliminate the reactionaries as a way to maintain power and the people "happy" and quiet.... the more reactionaries there are, the more slaughter there is.... of course, that limit on people's liberties can extend to banning certain ethnic groups...and those people are left with few options: somehow convert to one of the accepted groups, leave, or be killed. - This happened in Europe with the inquisition; nazi Germany with the abolition of jews; the bible with hebrews taking over Israel and imposing judaism on everyone there... with reprecussions to post-WW2 Israely palestinians; and many other places from South America to China, to Japan, to the old US west. - the law comes and whoever isn't covered gets trampled.

Today's global marketplace, TV, the internet... have given some of us a global awareness of the human race.... some of us have managed to take in a global morality where we essentially extend our naturally evolved local morality to the global village. It's not a perfect system... we can still feel powerless and take little to no action towards atrocities and other problems half-way across the world... but we tend to be aware of some of it and, at least, speak out for it. Some people will actually do something - unicef, or the red cross... but it is manifestly too little and it would be nice to have some coordination with international politics.
International politics... power plays... money... control... these are some of today's largest reasons for war... morality doesn't apply, here. That's why I think that the heads of any religion are fully aware that they make people believe in BS... but, of course, they'd never admit that... it would ruin the con.

[Brakeman]

I'm good because the devil is the source for bad morals and all evil and since I don't believe in him, I don't take his evil direction.

[dyresand]

I'm good because the devil is the source for bad morals and all evil and since I don't believe in him, I don't take his evil direction.

Wait.... shouldn't you be doing that to god after all the devil isn't necessarily evil. god creates good and evil, god god does more bad shit than the devil
throughout the bible also he gives the angels free will. Said angels rebel against him they know god better than humans know god, after all the true evil lurks
among the clouds. 

[Brakeman]

I'm good because the devil is the source for bad morals and all evil and since I don't believe in him, I don't take his evil direction.

Wait.... shouldn't you be doing that to god after all the devil isn't necessarily evil. god creates good and evil, god god does more bad shit than the devil
throughout the bible also he gives the angels free will. Said angels rebel against him they know god better than humans know god, after all the true evil lurks
among the clouds. 

Has no one ever told you that logic and jesus don't mix?

[dyresand]

Wait.... shouldn't you be doing that to god after all the devil isn't necessarily evil. god creates good and evil, god god does more bad shit than the devil
throughout the bible also he gives the angels free will. Said angels rebel against him they know god better than humans know god, after all the true evil lurks
among the clouds. 

Has no one ever told you that logic and jesus don't mix?

So.... i'm good because i don't believe in the devil and i am more morally superior to theists because of that? 

[Angrboda]

This.

We evolved to be a social species and certain behaviors/values promote our success as a social species.  So part of our evolving social behaviors involved developing a meta-cognitive faculty we call moral judgement.  We intuitively value good behavior, and are repulsed by impulses to engage in bad behavior.  It's a subconsciously driven system of influencing what our consciousness wants so as to promote behavior that benefits a social animal.  In short, evolution built us to desire the good.  (This basic desire is also shaped and reinforced by childhood training, along with an inbuilt desire to belong.)

jorm-

Stalin killed 30 million well-evolved men, women and children who were weaker than he was. Their evolution did not help them. 

And from HIS perspective, why be good when being bad reaped such benefits?

Because on the whole, the species condemns such actions as not being acceptable. Only 50% of Russians polled had a generally positive view of Stalin. And that's only the picture inside Russia. Here in the west, the oppressive regimes of the Soviet Union were largely condemned as being contrary to the interests of the people. Evolved traits present a spectrum of behaviors from predatory wolves to those who play the social game to sheep that shy away from participation. The temporary success of an outlier is not as important as the behavior of the center, because that's where the real power lies. There is a truism that it isn't small business which creates jobs, it's the customers that create the jobs by demanding specific goods. In a similar way, the real norms of society are set by the majority in the center, not the outliers. A few million Stalins, all clawing to reach the top is a recipe for disaster of the species, and the species as a whole pushes back. Hitler's vainglorious attempt to dominate the western world was opposed by his peaceful fellow countries, and the push back nearly destroyed Germany as a nation. The power is in the center.

[Randy Carson]

Quick post before I head to work...more later.

Can we discern any consensus of opinion from the posts thus far? Folks have offered many different reasons for "why" we are good including:

It makes me feel good
It makes me feel bad (when I do bad)
Convention
Evolution

Although the majority seem to hold to some combination of points 1, 2 & 3, I'm not convinced that any of these reasons adequately answer the question of "Why Be Good" - especially in light of the core element of evolution that the strong dominate the weak, etc. Clearly, even today, some people do NOT care about others...they do or take what they want with little to no regard for the consequences. Evolution has not eliminated this from these individuals or groups.

For example, the Vikings had no sense of remorse for invading the English coastal villages a thousand or so years ago. And what did the Romans ever do to the Visigoths to cause the latter to sack Rome? If the Goths were "evolved" (and they lived but a blink of an eye ago in the evolutionary timeline) and acting with the same sense of "good" and "bad" that folks here claim to have, why was plundering, pillaging and raping even on the to-do list for the Goths in the first place?

It seems to me that these are examples of Darwinism at work...and evidence that evolution's demand that only the strong survive is still in full effect.

[Alex K]

You are very confused about what scientific theories are if you think that evolution "demands" anything. And even more so if you think that the theory of evolution demands that "only the strong survive" or the strong dominate the weak, whatever that even means!