Can an atheist be ethical like theists

[huss88ein]

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Well it is not but when u r an atheist and ur community is not it can do that but [hide]when th

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whole community is believing that there is no god so where would these laws come from.
Let me give u an example if we are the society and we all agree here as people of that society that doing drugs is a personal choice then there will be a law permitting that.

And if we all agree that robbing a bad person isn't a bad thing then we legitimize too.

And if we all agree that incest is a personal matter then we will legitimize it too.

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And if we all agree that relegion is a disease we will eliminate all relegious people from our society because it is the law like what happened in china and Tibet.

So you see my point here it is all a matter of agreement of the majority. And the majority aren't always right .

By example the majority of people elected Hitler in germany.

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Moral rules are the product of selection over thousands of generations of various societies.
And they come up with some pretty strange rules.
There are actually societies that internally agree that cutting off the tip of men's penises is a good thing to do.
Then they claim that some God told them to do it.
And don't get me started on dietary conventions......
Some people drink secretions of cows.

Weird but true.

That's not the point here my point is what will make people abide by the law if it's not a divine power and dont tell me human nature because not all of the bad things to u are bad to the others and u said it ur self.

[Dystopia]

Can you actually provide evidence for this statistic? I mean, immigration policies are diverse and I'm certain Sweden hasn't received just Muslim immigrants, not to mention that the definition of what constitutes rape varies and sometimes there's different degrees of sexual assault. I'm not saying the statistic is false, I just want to know where you're getting the facts from.


Swedish Rape Rates

The blue bar represents Swedish born rapists.

Red bar is foreign born.

The only thing I can find on the internet about Muslims raping western women is in anti-Islam websites and white supremacist videos on youtube - Can you find me something that at least includes the methodology used and explains why the graph is there in the first place? Why should I trust that graph is telling the truth without even consulting the study itself and checking out for myself variables like the sample demographic, the definition of rape etc.

Therefore, only figures from 1985-1989 and 1995-2001 are covered for comparison.

Basically this is a terrible mistake because the latest statistic is from 2001 - The fact the article argues the government is covering it up is irrelevant because it sounds conspiratorial. Curiously, complains about Muslim immigrants have started a few years ago and continue to this day despite the fact those statistics represent a sample from 2001 when the population had less immigrants. I noted the definition of rape changed later, and assuming Sweden is a country that pursues extremely egalitarian gender-policies, shouldn't it be easier to report rapes (because there's less social prejudice etc) and therefore cause an increase in the number of reported rapes? In America statistics often show a high number of unreported cases, imagine how it would fire up if all victims started reporting.

[SteelCurtain]

why are drugs bad aren't they a choice?

Drugs are bad for certain people, but I agree, they should be a choice. I don't like drugs but I don't think the government should have any say in whether I am allowed to use mind altering substances.

Why is incist bad isn't it a choice?

As long as it is between two consenting adults with no power differential, I don't see a problem with it. Gross, but none of my business.

Why is robbing another country's oil is bad isn't it beneficial to the economy?

It is bad because it is taking advantage of the weak to benefit America's oil run economy. It is bad because a very small number of greedy assholes have decided to milk this planet for every last drop of oil and make a killing doing it. America is a bully and we play world police far too often. Not sure what this has to do with religion. It's money and more money equals more power.

Why being naked in public is bad you're not hurting anyone?

It isn't bad. So long as there are no children around. Who cares. A penis is a penis. A vagina is a vagina. Tits are tits. Meh.

[Dystopia]

Wow now you're referring to a group of people as a reference.

Well anybody can be a lowlife that's the answer.

Seriously?!

Sweden went from the lowest rape rate in Europe in the 80's, to the second highest in the world since Muslim immigration, and you are blaming it on a few lowlifes?

Read that statistic again, 77.6% of all rapes in Sweden are perpetrated by only 2% of the entire population. Just how do these few lowlifes get around Sweden? How much free time do they have?

Since Muslim immigration into Sweden, rape has gone up 1472%.

Essentially a coeteris paribus fallacy mixed with a post hoc because you are assuming because Muslims immigrated they had to cause the rape increase - Didn't you read the part when I told you (1) Sweden increased and widened the rape definition (2) Put policies in motion to increase the qualification and skills of authorities dealing with it to prosecute properly? 

You know, there was this economic example I learned two years ago - In a free market, prices go up and consumption goes down. Prices caused the lower consumption, right? Wrong, it could be caused by prices or not. You can't assume without looking at other variables. It turns out it could be caused by lower salaries, worse quality products or simply market and fashion trends. Careful with your assumptions Simon Moon.

Additionally, feel free to provide statistics I can trust and don't come from a website called "the muslim issue" that openly make the mistake of admitting those statistics are 11 years old and can't quote studies on a proper language I can read that specifically show Muslims are the majority of rapists.

[Neo-Scholastic]

Morality doesn't come from religion. It comes from the evolved human tendencies toward cooperation, empathy, and the avoidance of suffering.

Asserted without evidence.

[SteelCurtain]

Well, I say it's entirely germane to the main point. Your religion subjugates women, stifles free speech, and commits acts of extreme hate against gay people.

I could never be that kind of "ethical."

Calling some of the tenets of your religion ethical is fucking laughable in my book.

So, keeping it on topic, I would say disliking an entire group of people for something that they cannot control and has no effect on you is highly unethical and immoral.

What's wrong with gay people, Hussein?

Not true.
And I promise I will make a discussion about the gays and how is that seen in islam.

And for women aren't they free to decide , you deciding for them is not freedom.

What isn't true? Islam doesn't subjugate women, it's adherents don't do unspeakable things to people who happen to be homosexual? There aren't people who are murdered, jailed, beaten, lashed for speaking their minds about how your religion is bullshit?

I have evidence on my side, Hussein. I have images and articles showing that all these things happen.

Women are absolutely not free to decide in Islamic theocracies. Absolutely not.

This thread is about morality. We don't need to have a discussion about about why you think being gay is bad. We all know why. But what is absolutely on the table in this discussion is that you think being gay is bad.

[Anomalocaris]

Morality doesn't come from religion. It comes from the evolved human tendencies toward cooperation, empathy, and the avoidance of suffering.

Asserted without evidence.

Why should that bother you?

[huss88ein]

why are drugs bad aren't they a choice?

Drugs are bad for certain people, but I agree, they should be a choice. I don't like drugs but I don't think the government should have any say in whether I am allowed to use mind altering substances.

Why is incist bad isn't it a choice?

As long as it is between two consenting adults with no power differential, I don't see a problem with it. Gross, but none of my business.

Why is robbing another country's oil is bad isn't it beneficial to the economy?

It is bad because it is taking advantage of the weak to benefit America's oil run economy. It is bad because a very small number of greedy assholes have decided to milk this planet for every last drop of oil and make a killing doing it. America is a bully and we play world police far too often. Not sure what this has to do with religion. It's money and more money equals more power.

Why being naked in public is bad you're not hurting anyone?

It isn't bad. So long as there are no children around. Who cares. A penis is a penis. A vagina is a vagina. Tits are tits. Meh.

Then drug dealers aren't bad either cause they are giving the product that people demand and have the right to.

So is prostitution because it is a choice after all.

[SteelCurtain]

Then drug dealers aren't bad either cause they are giving the product that people demand and have the right to.

Correct.

So is prostitution because it is a choice after all.

Correct.

[SteelCurtain]

Morality doesn't come from religion. It comes from the evolved human tendencies toward cooperation, empathy, and the avoidance of suffering.

Asserted without evidence.

Agreed.

But you have a whole thread which you've abandoned wherein that is literally all you've done. So why don't you scurry on back there and provide some evidence for those assertions, Chad?