Humans evolved from monkeys

[Old Baby]

[SteelCurtain]

I see his point, now.

Prosimians and early Anthropoidea are considered monkeys, indeed. They are our ancestors. I think the argument begs the question and is misleading, but seeing where he's coming from, I can see why he's making it.

[Minimalist]

This.

His source is a "college source" thus undefeatable apparently.

"Liberty University" is a college, too.  It is full of jesus freak morons but it is still a college.  That, by itself, means absofuckinglutely nothing.

[The Valkyrie]

Then invite him to go fuck himself.  You don't owe an idiot anything.

Problem solved.

(You might try asking him for some such "journal" which says we did evolve from monkeys.)

Just trying to learn how I can back up my arguments.  Learning opportunity for me.

Back up your arguments with good academic sources and a brick.

[Old Baby]

I see his point, now.

Prosimians and early Anthropoidea are considered monkeys, indeed. They are our ancestors. I think the argument begs the question and is misleading, but seeing where he's coming from, I can see why he's making it.

If I'm understanding right, humans are cousins of extant monkeys, not descendants.  But, these early extinct monkeys are ancestors of the common ancestor humans share with apes.  Am I looking at this correctly?

[SteelCurtain]

Almost. The prosimians/Anthropoidea are ancestors of the common ancestor humans share with monkeys. We are apes.

The common theist argument is that we evolved from chimps and gorillas, and that's the point I thought he was making.

[Old Baby]

Almost. The prosimians/Anthropoidea are ancestors of the common ancestor humans share with monkeys. We are apes.

The common theist argument is that we evolved from chimps and gorillas, and that's the point I thought he was making.

Very interesting.  I never considered that the common ancestor of humans and monkeys could be... monkeys.  Seems kind of obvious, but it it's confusing when most of the sources out there say that humans did NOT evolve from monkeys.  I suppose they must be talking about extant monkeys.  Then again, maybe not every source recognizes those extinct monkey types as actual monkeys.

My head hurts.

[Kiekeben]

Almost. The prosimians/Anthropoidea are ancestors of the common ancestor humans share with monkeys. We are apes.

The common theist argument is that we evolved from chimps and gorillas, and that's the point I thought he was making.

Very interesting.  I never considered that the common ancestor of humans and monkeys could be... monkeys.  Seems kind of obvious, but it it's confusing when most of the sources out there say that humans did NOT evolve from monkeys.  I suppose they must be talking about extant monkeys.  Then again, maybe not every source recognizes those extinct monkey types as actual monkeys.

My head hurts.

It's very simple, really. I think the entire confusion here is due to two things: first, are we talking about our immediate ancestors, or just ancestors in general (including earlier ancestors); second, are we talking about current monkeys or monkeys in general (which includes extinct ones)?

Often, people who do not understand evolution think it says that we evolved from monkeys - or apes - that currently exist. And sometimes these are the same people who then ask "why are there still monkeys (apes)?" This often leads evolutionists to claim "we did not evolve from apes!" (meaning from any of the species in the current batch of apes) or from monkeys!

In fact, we did evolve from apes - and from monkeys. (Also, as some on this thread have already pointed out, we are apes - there is no reason to set humans apart from the other great apes, as all five species in the group are more closely related to one another than to the lesser apes, the gibbons). But what it means to say that humans evolved from apes is that our direct ancestor was an ape (what else would it be?!) - though of of course not an existing ape species (it was probably either Homo erectus or some closely related species). And what it means to say we evolved from monkeys is that we are descendants of monkeys - though not of any existing monkey species. Also, no monkey is our immediate ancestor, but at most a great-great-ancestor.

[Minimalist]

What really complicates things are that creatards haven't evolved at all.

[God of Mr. Hanky]

I think defining your terms might be helpful.

The term "monkey" is not synonymous with the word "ape."

Chimpanzees, Gorillas, Gibbons, and Bonobos are not monkeys. They are apes. So are humans.

All monkeys and apes are primates, however. Somewhere along the line, we all share a primate ancestor.

So your twitter friend is indeed incorrect. We evolved from an early primate ancestor, not a monkey. The monkeys are like cousins to our close Hominoidae Family.

But his point specifically is that we did evolve from monkeys.  The word "monkey" is very important because he's a theist schooling atheists who he says don't actually know anything about evolution.  I've found many sites that explain that humans did not evolve from monkeys, but he won't accept any source unless it's a science journal or equivalent.

Theists don't know the difference between monkeys and apes either, so don't feel bad if you didn't know that.

I believe the essential difference between monkeys and apes is:

1. Apes are indigenous only to Africa
2. Apes don't have tails