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Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
#21
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
Quote:POTV is the strongest proof of the existence of Allah in Islam

I have no doubt that this fairy tale exists in the minds of muslims.  It's anywhere else that needs evidence.... and not that pious prattle that you posted.
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#22
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
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#23
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
It would be very interesting if such a thing was discovered, yes. Sadly, it has not been.

If it's omnipresent, it should be right here next to me. How do I distinguish between this thing being next to me, and nothing being next to me?
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#24
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
(March 13, 2016 at 3:17 am)TheMuslim Wrote:
(March 13, 2016 at 1:20 am)Irrational Wrote: Ok, but can finite entities not be part of an infinite reality?

Please elaborate. Are you asking if finite entities like galaxies can be part of an infinite set of universes? Sure they can, why not. But I don't see how this would lead to a problem in the argument if that's what you're trying to say. As explained before, the argument doesn't take aggregates or groups (whether they have a finite or infinite number of constituents) as actual realities (I take your "Ok" as a sign that you've understood this).
Like I said earlier, I'm finding this a bit too confusing to understand, hence why I'm asking questions that may seem a bit silly and not extending from what you're actually arguing.
Ok, I understand your answer to my latest question and will accept it as true unless I realize a flaw with the answer.
So my next question is based on the next quote:

Quote:Therefore, the first ontological proposition, which the human being cannot not know, is the affirmation of the basic reality, and its modality is eternal necessity.  And since, as just explained, finite entities, such as the heavens, the earth, the cosmos, and so forth, cannot be the extension of this proposition, its extension is only an Absolute Reality—Who is above the restrictions of conditions, is present with all of the finite realities, and no absence or termination is perceivable with respect to Him.

Bold mine. Why must there be such an extension? Will basic reality not suffice?
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#25
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
(March 12, 2016 at 7:58 am)Alex K Wrote: @TheMuslim

Can you briefly state which properties this proof shows the proven god to have?
The fool hath said in his heart, There is a God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
Psalm 14, KJV revised edition

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#26
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
(March 13, 2016 at 7:11 am)Alex K Wrote:
(March 12, 2016 at 7:58 am)Alex K Wrote: @TheMuslim

Can you briefly state which properties this proof shows the proven god to have?

I think it means God unites all existence and it's features in an ultimate way.  God is everything but nothing in particular. God is each thing at it's ultimate. God is all things without diversity in his essence though. This what this argument proves. 

The reason why was demonstrated in the OP.
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#27
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
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#28
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
Could you explain how we get from this argument to the idea that eating pork and drinking alcohol is bad?
I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty. I must not be nasty.
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#29
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
(March 13, 2016 at 7:51 am)MysticKnight Wrote:
(March 13, 2016 at 7:11 am)Alex K Wrote:

I think it means God unites all existence and it's features in an ultimate way.  God is everything but nothing in particular. God is each thing at it's ultimate. God is all things without diversity in his essence though. This what this argument proves. 

The reason why was demonstrated in the OP.

Great. Calling that God is highly misleading. You could just as well call it the Universe and be done with it. Nothing about being a person who created us, cares about where we stick what and punishes us and awaits us in an afterlife. Not God. Not YHWH, not Allah.
The fool hath said in his heart, There is a God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
Psalm 14, KJV revised edition

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#30
RE: Shia Islamic Argument for the existence of God
(March 13, 2016 at 11:57 am)Alex K Wrote:
(March 13, 2016 at 7:51 am)MysticKnight Wrote: I think it means God unites all existence and it's features in an ultimate way.  God is everything but nothing in particular. God is each thing at it's ultimate. God is all things without diversity in his essence though. This what this argument proves. 

The reason why was demonstrated in the OP.

Great. Calling that God is highly misleading. You could just as well call it the Universe and be done with it. Nothing about being a person who created us, cares about where we stick what and punishes us and awaits us in an afterlife. Not God. Not YHWH, not Allah.

Language barrier. Do you remember what the OP said about parts and whole, and why it must be one or simple?
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