Curious to know

[robvalue]

0-0-36

Good job you guys Bullshit not on the menu today.

[Fake Messiah]

Yeah, Little Shit really got you with this topic. I mean what if Neil DeGrasse Tyson had a Marian vision and converted to Catholicism would you believe then? Or what if Neil Tyson saw Jesus on his toast or even went to outer space and saw that Earth is actually flat?! Or Sam Harris got abducted by aliens!
I mean Jesus! You atheists are so close minded! You have this few authoritative figures, that are your versions of popes and what they tell you reality is you listen to them.
I would never be in your skin because any day now Richard Dawkins could get Jesus' stigmatas and then your noisy negativism would turn upside down and you would look so stupid.

[Little Rik]

Roberto.  

Let me saying something about science or the physical science that you mean.
The consciousness is something abstract not something physical therefore it is obvious that
the physical science is unable to understand it.

The operating system on this computer is abstract.  It's also realized in the physical fact of the electrons flowing through its various circuits.  That something appears abstract to you is not evidence that it is non-physical.  And your assertion is far from obvious.

Wrong again yog.  

Abstract is the mind that build the computer or the car or any other thing.
The computer is as physical as your body that wouldn't move unless YOU
decide so.  

[Little Rik]

Yeah, Little Shit really got you with this topic. I mean what if Neil DeGrasse Tyson had a Marian vision and converted to Catholicism would you believe then? Or what if Neil Tyson saw Jesus on his toast or even went to outer space and saw that Earth is actually flat?! Or Sam Harris got abducted by aliens!
I mean Jesus! You atheists are so close minded! You have this few authoritative figures, that are your versions of popes and what they tell you reality is you listen to them.
I would never be in your skin because any day now Richard Dawkins could get Jesus' stigmatas and then your noisy negativism would turn upside down and you would look so stupid.

Too many IF.
That is all about fantasy.
The reality is the only thing to take in consideration.  

[Little Rik]

0-0-36

Good job you guys Bullshit not on the menu today.

You can only say good job when the job is completed.
So far you haven't completed anything at all.
Just dreaming that this universe pop up by magic and nobody control it.  

[robvalue]

Didn't answer my question yet.

How many theists have to change to atheists through NDE before you become an atheist?

[Little Rik]

100% wrong brother.
If you go through the hundreds of NDEs you will find countless of ex non believers and atheists that had absolutely nothing with religions.
By the way you are not answering the question or making a comment about yes or not.  

These conversions based on special preludes of the afterlife are biblically invalid. They make faith unnecessary and without faith it is impossible to please god.

No matter how respectable they might be, they would still have to undergo some kind of trauma to have an NDE.

 This god who can only reveal himself to people under trauma is no different from temple prostitutes who take drugs to communicate with spirits.

How do you know that.......... god who can only reveal himself to people under trauma............?

[Little Rik]

Didn't answer my question yet.

How many theists have to change to atheists through NDE before you become an atheist?

NDEs lead to God so there is no way that that will ever happen.

If you have any doubt about that go and see many of the NDEs experiences in this web site.

http://www.nderf.org/NDERF/NDE_Archives/...counts.htm

Your question is the most stupid I ever heard.
It is like to say........how many people that are heading to London end up in Liverpool?
If you head to London you end up in London not Liverpool.  

[Gemini]

The doctors used to use ketamine on me as a surgical anaesthetic back in the late 80s/early 90s.  Pre-teen me tripped balls on that shit.  I mean, dreams of my mom operating on me, giant 3D letters whizzing by my head, a castle on a floating rock in the middle of a storm cloud... Stuff that I still remember because it was so vivid, with sounds and smells and tactile sensations as well as the visuals.

One hypothesis to explain NDEs is that is that the brain has a defense mechanism against exitotoxicity from excess glutamate, such as is released in response to oxygen deficiency. Blockading the NMDA receptor protects neurons, but also causes dissociation. This is exactly what ketamine does, and there are a number of similarities between ketamine-induced experiences and NDEs. 

What we know is that a person doesn't have to be clinically dead or even in a life threatening situation to have a NDE--Howard Storm is an example. Also, young children who have NDEs often report seeing fictional characters like Santa Claus up in heaven. 

So I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be convinced even if I myself had a NDE. Skeptics have these kinds of experiences all the time and aren't swayed--A. J. Ayer is an example (there's plenty more examples in William James's "The Varieties of Religious Experience").

[Cyberman]

Back in the day, I had a hypnagogic experience (actually I've had several that I can remember, but this is the most notable for me). I've spoken about it before so I won't go into it here - especially here. The point is that I wasn't convinced by it even while I was experiencing it, remarkable as it was at the time.