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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:30 pm
(This post was last modified: November 4, 2016 at 5:31 pm by Excited Penguin.)
(November 4, 2016 at 5:18 pm)Mathilda Wrote: (November 4, 2016 at 5:15 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote: That's because we outsmart them.
As for how, it's simple. Faulty programming.
K
So the smart toaster becomes faulty and stops working? The self driving car needs to be rebooted? Yeah. Definite apocalypse there.
No, the A. G. I. begins improving itself at a rate much faster than a human and we get an extremely smart mind in a box. If you think its lack of limbs is going to be a problem. . . I have no idea why you would think that. If I were 10.000 times smarter than you, you wouldn't fear me because of my body.
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:31 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:22 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: We're talking about a distant future where AI is far more smart than us, has a mind of its own and has its own interests.
So let's break this down, shall we?
First, we don't know what such a hypothetical AI looks like, but it's fair to assume it ill need some kind of casing. Computer, machine, organism even - we're talking about the future after all.
For it to function, it will take processing power, lots of it. And processing power means nothing if there isn't energy. Energy has to come from somewhere and isn't available everywhere. Not even solar power.
Since we have that established, we can move on to the hypothetical AIs mental capacities. How can a thing, designed by human intellect, assembled by human ingenuity, possibly surpass human intellect and ingenuity? It could process faster, given the right amount of energy and processing power. Computers do that for us already, but it can't actually surpass the intellect available when it's assembled.
But let's give you the Albert Einstein of AIs. It goes rogue, so what does it do when we simply cut the grid? How does it maintain itself to pose a threat. It would need access to components, energy and the ability to manually work on itself while still functioning at full power while damaged.
How likely is all of this coming together anytime?
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:36 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:31 pm)abaris Wrote: How can a thing, designed by human intellect, assembled by human ingenuity, possibly surpass human intellect and ingenuity?
How couldn't it?
Isn't that rather like asking "how could intelligent humans evolve from singe selled organisms?"
Seems like the genetic fallacy from me. Why would intelligent AI in the future be limited by the intelligence of those who created?
Quote: It could process faster, given the right amount of energy and processing power. Computers do that for us already, but it can't actually surpass the intellect available when it's assembled.
Why not?
We're talking about future intelligences where the AIs can think for themselves like humans... only much more intelligent.
Quote:How likely is all of this coming together anytime?
Like anytime soon? Like he said.... all it takes is us to keep going, it doesn't have to be anytime soon.
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:38 pm
(This post was last modified: November 4, 2016 at 5:39 pm by abaris.)
(November 4, 2016 at 5:36 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: Like anytime soon? Like he said.... all it takes is us to keep going, it doesn't have to be anytime soon.
You didn't adress the most important parts of my post. Why's that?
To repeat in a simple chain of words: Casing, processing power, energy, the ability to maintain itself, access to the necessary components, functioning at full capacity while damaged.
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:39 pm
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:43 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:22 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: No not faulty. Like why do people kill ants? Because most people have more important things on their minds and don't give a shit. They're pests.
We're talking about a distant future where AI is far more smart than us, has a mind of its own and has its own interests.
No one worried about Einstein going on a killing spree and he had a working body. Certainly no one contemplates the possibility of Stephen Hawking doing it. He's a brain in a wheel chair. Or to use Sam Harris's example, John von Neumann. We each have our own interests, our own mind and some of us are smarter than others. So? What's going to happen?
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:45 pm
(This post was last modified: November 4, 2016 at 5:47 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Quote:If people think we should be afraid of large, super intelligent organisms with the capacity change the world, then why not be afraid of corporations? They can be made up of hundreds of thousands of brains all specialising in particular areas. They are a far more immediate threat than AI yet we can still control them. They are still accountable.
Can we...are they...it's starting to look like that may not be true...and we clearly -do- have reason to fear them.......some of their achievements read like a demons resume. If this is the sneak peak of what a greater intelligence than our own can bring...how could you possibly be disagreeing with Harris...?
I see you've decided to go the batshit christer route of deciding which questions are proper. Good for you, lol.
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:46 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:30 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote: (November 4, 2016 at 5:18 pm)Mathilda Wrote: K
So the smart toaster becomes faulty and stops working? The self driving car needs to be rebooted? Yeah. Definite apocalypse there.
No, the A. G. I. begins improving itself at a rate much faster than a human and we get an extremely smart mind in a box. If you think its lack of limbs is going to be a problem. . . I have no idea why you would think that. If I were 10.000 times smarter than you, you wouldn't fear me because of my body.
And how would AGI improve itself exponentially faster than a human?
If you were 10,000 times smarter than me, why would I have to fear you?
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:47 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:39 pm)Mathilda Wrote: Ah good. A proper question. Thank you.
Here's another one. Every AI will only be a product of the technology available at the time of it's creation. It will never be a species being subject to evolution, since the technology will consist of hardware and software of the time of creation. It's impossible to evolve beyond the technological limits.
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RE: Can we build AI without losing control over it? | Sam Harris
November 4, 2016 at 5:47 pm
(November 4, 2016 at 5:38 pm)abaris Wrote: (November 4, 2016 at 5:36 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: Like anytime soon? Like he said.... all it takes is us to keep going, it doesn't have to be anytime soon.
You didn't adress the most important parts of my post. Why's that?
To repeat in a simple chain of words: Casing, processing power, energy, the ability to maintain itself, access to the necessary components, functioning at full capacity while damaged.
How is this the most important part?
The premise is already that AI is getting better and better... I don't see how it's going to happen is relevant. There are numerous ways and numerous resources.
The sun doesn't have unlimited energy but it's not exactly going to run out.
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