Posts: 19881
Threads: 324
Joined: July 31, 2016
Reputation:
34
Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 10:16 pm
We often see claims that "macro" evolution, the sudden, unprecedented change in life form simply doesn't happen.
However, can we use that to explain two head calves? (Bear with me if that's not an actual mutations, it's an example for for now.) That's not a beneficial mutation but it is a large change. Is it possible that the genetic code doesn't allow for macro because the disadvantages to a living thing outweigh the advantages? Some "slip through" and in the provisional calf model, but they're not successful, because of the lack of mates closes enough the macro to allow successful passing along to genes?
Or maybe I still stoned a bit from the hospital meds. It's been a longggg week.
Posts: 3064
Threads: 3
Joined: July 10, 2016
Reputation:
36
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 10:21 pm
The whole "macro" and "micro" evolution distinction was never brought up by scientists in the first place. Creationists came up with that to try to stick a wrench in the gears of science. Evolution is just evolution.
Posts: 7175
Threads: 12
Joined: March 14, 2013
Reputation:
72
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 10:27 pm
(This post was last modified: December 18, 2016 at 10:27 pm by Tonus.)
I think it's a tough definition to pin down. What is macroevolution? Is it a crocoduck? Is it the appearance of a new species?
The theory of evolution does not allow for sudden, unprecedented changes in a life form. If we were to observe that happening (ie, crocoduck) then the theory would have sprung a very serious leak. As for two-headed animals, that's a mutation that seems to pop up now and then but doesn't seem to confer many benefits.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
Posts: 11697
Threads: 117
Joined: November 5, 2016
Reputation:
43
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 10:50 pm
(This post was last modified: December 18, 2016 at 10:52 pm by Amarok.)
(December 18, 2016 at 10:27 pm)Tonus Wrote: I think it's a tough definition to pin down. What is macroevolution? Is it a crocoduck? Is it the appearance of a new species?
The theory of evolution does not allow for sudden, unprecedented changes in a life form. If we were to observe that happening (ie, crocoduck) then the theory would have sprung a very serious leak. As for two-headed animals, that's a mutation that seems to pop up now and then but doesn't seem to confer many benefits.
indeed
if it's a cocoduck then there demanding a miracle not evolution
if it's just a new species then it's been witnessed a hundred times
if there demanding to see a non avian dinosaur become an avian then ask them if they have a few million years if they complain that it can't be observed then remind them were talking about populations and genetics which don't work at our fuss
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
Posts: 6014
Threads: 253
Joined: January 2, 2013
Reputation:
30
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 10:58 pm
(This post was last modified: December 18, 2016 at 10:58 pm by paulpablo.)
(December 18, 2016 at 10:16 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: We often see claims that "macro" evolution, the sudden, unprecedented change in life form simply doesn't happen.
However, can we use that to explain two head calves? (Bear with me if that's not an actual mutations, it's an example for for now.) That's not a beneficial mutation but it is a large change. Is it possible that the genetic code doesn't allow for macro because the disadvantages to a living thing outweigh the advantages? Some "slip through" and in the provisional calf model, but they're not successful, because of the lack of mates closes enough the macro to allow successful passing along to genes?
Or maybe I still stoned a bit from the hospital meds. It's been a longggg week.
Not a biologist but I'm sure I remember Richard Dawkins explaining it like micro evolution is macro evolution the only difference being the time periods involved.
I wish I was as stoned as you though to be thinking about two headed calves haha.
Good luck with whatever you're taking the meds for though.
Are you ready for the fire? We are firemen. WE ARE FIREMEN! The heat doesn’t bother us. We live in the heat. We train in the heat. It tells us that we’re ready, we’re at home, we’re where we’re supposed to be. Flames don’t intimidate us. What do we do? We control the flame. We control them. We move the flames where we want to. And then we extinguish them.
Impersonation is treason.
Posts: 19881
Threads: 324
Joined: July 31, 2016
Reputation:
34
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 18, 2016 at 11:09 pm
Fentanyl and hydrocodone, post-op complications from a cholecystectomy.
And for the micro v. macro. issues, I'm aware of them. The OP was focused to one part of that creationist chicken coup.
I think.
Posts: 3709
Threads: 18
Joined: September 29, 2015
Reputation:
10
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 19, 2016 at 12:07 am
(December 18, 2016 at 10:21 pm)Jesster Wrote: The whole "macro" and "micro" evolution distinction was never brought up by scientists in the first place. Creationists came up with that to try to stick a wrench in the gears of science. Evolution is just evolution.
I think you may wan to check on the accuracy of this statement!
Posts: 3064
Threads: 3
Joined: July 10, 2016
Reputation:
36
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 19, 2016 at 12:23 am
(December 19, 2016 at 12:07 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: (December 18, 2016 at 10:21 pm)Jesster Wrote: The whole "macro" and "micro" evolution distinction was never brought up by scientists in the first place. Creationists came up with that to try to stick a wrench in the gears of science. Evolution is just evolution.
I think you may wan to check on the accuracy of this statement!
I think you may want to pull your head out of your ass.
Posts: 3709
Threads: 18
Joined: September 29, 2015
Reputation:
10
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 19, 2016 at 12:46 am
Ok... jester doesn't care, but others may want to check the accuracy of that statement!
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. - Alexander Vilenkin
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther
Posts: 2292
Threads: 16
Joined: September 28, 2015
Reputation:
24
RE: Test My Theory: Macro evolution DOES happen?
December 19, 2016 at 12:48 am
(This post was last modified: December 19, 2016 at 1:10 am by ApeNotKillApe.)
(December 19, 2016 at 12:46 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: Ok... jester doesn't care, but others may want to check the accuracy of that statement!
I have. You're wrong.
I am John Cena's hip-hop album.
|
