Posts: 22080
Threads: 24
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 1:48 pm
(This post was last modified: March 12, 2017 at 1:56 pm by Thumpalumpacus.)
(March 12, 2017 at 12:49 pm)Orochi Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 11:28 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: They don't have any boots with bootstraps! What do you expect?!
Bootstraps . Most of these people don't even have boots
There an echo in here?
(March 12, 2017 at 1:30 pm)Tiberius Wrote: I don't even think equality of opportunity is what we should be aiming for. Clearly if you are born into a family with a family business, you already have an advantage in that business.
Rather than aiming for equality which realistically will never happen, we should be striving to reduce the systemic inequalities that exist. Bring back the American dream.
I think you and I both agree that it's not the government's place to regulate private wealth. The equality of opportunity I was talking about upthread was not along those lines, but along socio-cultural lines: equal access to good education, good jobs, and so on.
I don't know that the American dream ever existed for more than a minority of Americans at any one time, except perhaps in the 50s. Sometimes I'm not even sure what it means. But I do know that I shouldn't be denied a shot at it for being this or that ethnicity, or female, or Muslim. Equality of financial opportunity shouldn't be regulated. Equality of cultural opportunity should.
Posts: 19788
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 2:12 pm
(March 12, 2017 at 11:12 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Do you think competition is the only engine for growth? Do you think it's the only inspiration for folks?
What an impoverished view of people you have, Scoobs.
He is a Christian, by definition his view of people's intrinsic worth uninflated by the imaginary grace of a dead egomaniacal Jewish carpenter is impoverished. Hence he thank the lord, not those by whose labor he receives his food.
Posts: 22080
Threads: 24
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 2:22 pm
(March 12, 2017 at 2:12 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 11:12 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Do you think competition is the only engine for growth? Do you think it's the only inspiration for folks?
What an impoverished view of people you have, Scoobs.
He is a Christian, by definition his view of people's intrinsic worth uninflated by the imaginary grace of a dead egomaniacal Jewish carpenter is impoverished. Hence he thank the lord, not those by whose labor he receives his food.
I've no doubt he can speak for himself.
Posts: 19788
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 2:37 pm
Yes, how do we know it is not his lord holding his finger or larynx and speaking for him? Much as the ghostly fingers of Jesus supposedly, according to what appear to be scooby, holding trump's hand?
Posts: 11697
Threads: 117
Joined: November 5, 2016
Reputation:
43
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 3:27 pm
(March 12, 2017 at 1:48 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 12:49 pm)Orochi Wrote: Bootstraps . Most of these people don't even have boots
There an echo in here?
(March 12, 2017 at 1:30 pm)Tiberius Wrote: I don't even think equality of opportunity is what we should be aiming for. Clearly if you are born into a family with a family business, you already have an advantage in that business.
Rather than aiming for equality which realistically will never happen, we should be striving to reduce the systemic inequalities that exist. Bring back the American dream.
I think you and I both agree that it's not the government's place to regulate private wealth. The equality of opportunity I was talking about upthread was not along those lines, but along socio-cultural lines: equal access to good education, good jobs, and so on.
I don't know that the American dream ever existed for more than a minority of Americans at any one time, except perhaps in the 50s. Sometimes I'm not even sure what it means. But I do know that I shouldn't be denied a shot at it for being this or that ethnicity, or female, or Muslim. Equality of financial opportunity shouldn't be regulated. Equality of cultural opportunity should.
Did I say boots meant to say feet
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
Posts: 22080
Threads: 24
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 12, 2017 at 4:41 pm
(March 12, 2017 at 2:37 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: Yes, how do we know it is not his lord holding his finger or larynx and speaking for him? Much as the ghostly fingers of Jesus supposedly, according to what appear to be scooby, holding trump's hand?
And yet you'd accord that prerogative to yourself. Got it.
Posts: 8731
Threads: 425
Joined: October 7, 2014
Reputation:
37
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 13, 2017 at 1:06 am
(March 6, 2017 at 4:06 am)InquiringMind Wrote: I have an idea. Why has inequality in society (wealth, race, gender, etc.) stubbornly persisted in spite of many decades of efforts to alleviate it? Why has the discussion of privilege only intensified after much work to create equality? Here's idea:
No one actually wants an equal society.
How could you be rich if everyone had the same amount of money? How could you have the best job if all jobs were equally good? How could you be the best scientist if all scientists were equally good? How could you have an especially attractive mate if all people were equally attractive? If all posts on facebook were equally good, then why would it matter which ones you looked at?
In an equal society, there is never any chance to "get ahead" because everyone is equal. There is no such thing as "greatness" because everyone is equally good. No one wants this. Everyone wants the chance to "get ahead." Everyone wants a chance to climb to the top of the pyramid, to be a hero, and to be respected and admired above their peers.
No one wants equality. Every individual wants to live in a society where they, as an individual, are at they top of the social pyramid. People want high status, not equality.
What are your thoughts?
Im not for equality and i am not for forced diversity. But at the same time i want a society were you work hard you earn what you deserve.
Not a society like now where no matter how hard you work being someone who is poor and works two to three jobs they shouldn't really even have to struggle to survive
but that is the reality of things.
Atheism is a non-prophet organization join today.
Code: <iframe width="100%" height="450" scrolling="no" frameborder="no" src="https://w.soundcloud.com/player/?url=https%3A//api.soundcloud.com/tracks/255506953&auto_play=false&hide_related=false&show_comments=true&show_user=true&show_reposts=false&visual=true"></iframe>
Posts: 6191
Threads: 124
Joined: November 13, 2009
Reputation:
70
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 13, 2017 at 2:10 pm
(March 12, 2017 at 4:41 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 2:37 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: Yes, how do we know it is not his lord holding his finger or larynx and speaking for him? Much as the ghostly fingers of Jesus supposedly, according to what appear to be scooby, holding trump's hand?
And yet you'd accord that prerogative to yourself. Got it.
Considering it is a valid criticism that represents scoobys postings fairly to mock it, your response is puzzling. It's as if you cannot grasp ridicule for what it is and instead resort to reacting mindlessly.
Sad.
Slave to the Patriarchy no more
Posts: 19788
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 13, 2017 at 7:59 pm
(This post was last modified: March 13, 2017 at 8:04 pm by Anomalocaris.)
(March 12, 2017 at 4:41 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 2:37 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: Yes, how do we know it is not his lord holding his finger or larynx and speaking for him? Much as the ghostly fingers of Jesus supposedly, according to what appear to be scooby, holding trump's hand?
And yet you'd accord that prerogative to yourself. Got it.
Of course, how can I of flesh and blood and with a conscience not be comprehensively superior to his nonexistent and bloodthirsty god?
Posts: 22080
Threads: 24
Joined: February 2, 2010
Reputation:
106
RE: No One Actually Wants an Equal Society
March 14, 2017 at 3:53 pm
(March 13, 2017 at 2:10 pm)Moros Synackaon Wrote: (March 12, 2017 at 4:41 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: And yet you'd accord that prerogative to yourself. Got it.
Considering it is a valid criticism that represents scoobys postings fairly to mock it, your response is puzzling. It's as if you cannot grasp ridicule for what it is and instead resort to reacting mindlessly.
Sad.
No. I prefer letting people speak for themselves rather than allowing third parties to set up caricatures.
See, I like dealing with people as people, not stereotypes, cliches, or strawmen. Your mileage seems to vary.
|
