Effectiveness of rating scales for suicide risk

[brewer]

[Faith No More]

No surprise there. I don't know how these scales work, but predicting suicide is basically trying to read people's minds. That's obviously problematic.

[brewer]

Agree, rating scales are not individualized and do not address the individual nuances of each person/situation.

[chimp3]

In practice , the diagnosis of risk for suicide is tempered by the at risk persons civil liberties. In the U.S. at least, holding someone against their will requires a judges order. Even if it for their own safety. So , the diagnostic tools are geared toward getting the sufferer to admit they have suicidal ideations, a suicide plan, and the means to carry out the plan. These questions are designed to meet legal standards for involuntary institutionalization.

[vorlon13]

and there's a continuum of conduct shading into suicide

where's the line between risky thrill seeking, neglect of ones health care, associating with 'dangerous' types . . . .

[Jackalope]

No surprise there.  I don't know how these scales work, but predicting suicide is basically trying to read people's minds.  That's obviously problematic.

Yes, and that's confounded by impulsivity and the fact that it's based in large part on self-reporting.

[Jackalope]

and there's a continuum of conduct shading into suicide

where's the line between risky thrill seeking, neglect of ones health care, associating with 'dangerous' types . . . .

I suppose it's intent. Sometimes it's just thrill seeking, sometimes it's 'fuck it, what do I have to live for?'

[Ravenshire]

In the U.S. at least, holding someone against their will requires a judges order. Even if it for their own safety.

Yes and no. While a person cannot be institutionalized against their will without a court order, a 72-hour hold without one is perfectly legal.

[chimp3]

In the U.S. at least, holding someone against their will requires a judges order. Even if it for their own safety.

Yes and no. While a person cannot be institutionalized against their will without a court order, a 72-hour hold without one is perfectly legal.

Not without substantial evidence. I have attempted to send people threatening suicide to the State Hospital. One was actually jamming a sharpened paper clip into his wrists. Repeatedly. They go in, get interviewed, and are sent right back to the institutions where I work. I know of 2 that were successful at suicide within a few days after we sent them home. 72 hour holds are still legally defined and confined.

[brewer]

Yes and no. While a person cannot be institutionalized against their will without a court order, a 72-hour hold without one is perfectly legal.

Not without substantial evidence. I have attempted to send people threatening suicide to the State Hospital. One was actually jamming a sharpened paper clip into his wrists. Repeatedly. They go in, get interviewed, and are sent right back to the institutions where I work. I know of 2 that were successful at suicide within a few days after we sent them home. 72 hour holds are still legally defined and confined.

That just tells me that something is being missed, either within the institution/process itself or by clever deception on the part of the patient.