When does biblical history begin ?

[Fireball]

Actually we don't.  You have your gospels which are propaganda and not history.



Archaeologist William Dever uses the terms Syro-Palestinian history because the bible is simply not a reliable source.

Your boy Bart Ehrman says differently.

I see your Bart Ehrman and raise you one Richard Carrier.

[Catholic_Lady]

Personally I think the bible becomes real history with the story of Jesus. We have historical evidence of His existence...

This is a blatant knowing lie. Produce that evidence now! You have the floor. All eyes are upon you.

Not a lie at all. The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time. I remember even when I went to a public high school, Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity. His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed. You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

There was no one named "Jesus" in ancient times.  The name didn't exist until 1630, which is 387 years ago.  

Now since almost everything you know is less than 100 years old why do you continue to believe silly ancient fairy tales?

*emphasis mine*
You do realize that the King James version of the bible was published in 1611 right? Not to mention the name also appears in the Wycliffe version of the bible (although it's written in middle english) published in the late 1300's

Your mistake is that you don't have an original 1611 KJV.  Your KJV was written after 1885.  

Your Wycliffe version was written well after the 14th Century.

---

This is a blatant knowing lie. Produce that evidence now! You have the floor. All eyes are upon you.

Not a lie at all. The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time. I remember even when I went to a public high school, Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity. His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed. You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

Yeshua didn't found Christianity; the character Paul did.

[Succubus]

This is a blatant knowing lie. Produce that evidence now! You have the floor. All eyes are upon you.

Not a lie at all. The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time. I remember even when I went to a public high school, Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity. His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed. You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

We have historical evidence of His existence...

Liar!

The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time.

Liar! Name these historians.

Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity.

Liar! There is no such book, and Jesus did not found Christianity.

His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed.

Liar!

You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

Liar! Jesus does not appear in history. Anywhere, at all, ever.

[Catholic_Lady]

Not a lie at all. The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time. I remember even when I went to a public high school, Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity. His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed. You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

We have historical evidence of His existence...

Liar!

The general consensus amongst historians world wide is that Jesus was a real person who died by crucifixion under punctious pilot, the Roman prefect at the time.

Liar! Name these historians.

Jesus' was mentioned in our World History book as the man who founded Christianity.

Liar! There is no such book, and Jesus did not found Christianity.

His existence is just as much a historical fact as Cleopatra, Julius Caesar, and Mohammed.

Liar!

You can deny it all you want I suppose, but that is not what is widely accepted by people who actually study/investigate history.

Liar! Jesus does not appear in history. Anywhere, at all, ever.

Ok.

[Succubus]

Liar!


Liar! Name these historians.


Liar! There is no such book, and Jesus did not found Christianity.


Liar!


Liar! Jesus does not appear in history. Anywhere, at all, ever.

Ok.

What do you mean, OK?
I have always doubted your sincerity.

[Haipule]

Okay here's my question,

These days there are many Christians who will support evolution and a very old earth 4.5 billions years old, with a universe that's along the lines of 14 billion years.

Somewhere in this period they throw humanity into the mix some believe Adam and Eve could still have existed, or be created especially during the time that humans were also evolving, others believe that Adam and Eve were just a story of man's fall from grace. Given that most biblical characters can be dated back by linage to Adam and Eve's children that gives us a period of around 6,000~7,000 years since those people existed.  When does what the bible says become real history ?

Where does it place original sin in this context ?

There is no such thing as "original sin' biblically. There is absativally no word in scripture that can possibly be translated as "sin" in any modern sense. That is all post-denominational theologic nonsense(since the 2nd century). Biblically speaking, man had a problem and God dealt with it COMPLETELY: independent of man! Just say thank you!

The Hebrew chattah (OT) and the Greek word hamartia (NT), both translated into English as "sin", and that erroneously transliterated from the Latin 'sinistra' meaning left hand, literally means: the errant flight of an arrow flung from a bow with out any concern for the harm it may cause self, or others. Therefore, no harm, no foul, no matter what you call a "sin"! Sin means: whatever you say it means and to as many whom are dumb enough to listen to you. The Hebrew and Greek word figuratively mean: off course, off target, errant, wrong way, amiss, dead end, etc. Those words never referred to the things that you do but where you are going.

The so called "original sin" of Adam means, both in the Hebrew (anar), and the Greek (parabasis): violation against a set point or standard. Like a seawall designed to hold back the surf. If that point is violated, it will make a huge mess. Adam made a huge mess! God fixed it--DONE! 'Nuff said.

The question is: where do we go from here?

[Catholic_Lady]

Ok.

What do you mean, OK?
I have always doubted your sincerity, so now is your chance to allay my suspicions. Convince me you are genuine.

No thanks, I'm good. Someone who is just sitting there and calling me a liar isn't someone who I want to try to have a discussion with. Besides, I've seen enough of your posts around these forums to see that you're kind of an A hole.

[Minimalist]

Ehrman is not an archaeologist.

But he is a metric fuckton smarter than you, huggy.

[Little Rik]

Actually we don't.  You have your gospels which are propaganda and not history.



Archaeologist William Dever uses the terms Syro-Palestinian history because the bible is simply not a reliable source.

Propaganda not history?

Are you going to be a total fool until your last breath?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus