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Hanging out at a friends house last night.
#11
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
You're wrong here.

If you're a guest in someone's house, they still get to pray before a meal as is their custom, even if you're there.

You don't have to pray. If they know you well enough to to know you don't pray, then they would expect that you wouldn't.

Just don't pray. But to be upset when other people do is just petty.
"There remain four irreducible objections to religious faith: that it wholly misrepresents the origins of man and the cosmos, that because of this original error it manages to combine the maximum servility with the maximum of solipsism, that it is both the result and the cause of dangerous sexual repression, and that it is ultimately grounded on wish-thinking." ~Christopher Hitchens, god is not Great

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#12
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."
— Charles James Napier

Asking people to pray is their custom. It is not yours. Objecting to being asked to pray is your custom. It is not theirs. Rituals typically function to bind people together and in this case you did not wish to be so bound. I get that you prefer to remain unbound with regard to this ritual, but asking them not to engage in their rituals because you don't want to participate in them and find simply being asked... offensive? seems a bit silly and somewhat worse than the offense you are attempting to prosecute.

Having been asked to say the blessing at dinner one Thanksgiving, I bowed my head and said, "Thank you God for not existing." It did not go over well, but it was quickly forgotten. I'm not saying I shouldn't have said what I did. They had their ritual, and I engaged in mine. Nobody seems to have won in that exchange.
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#13
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 10:44 am)SteelCurtain Wrote: You're wrong here.

If you're a guest in someone's house, they still get to pray before a meal as is their custom, even if you're there.

You don't have to pray. If they know you well enough to to know you don't pray, then they would expect that you wouldn't.

Just don't pray. But to be upset when other people do is just petty.

YES and again, so? It is still their custom, not mine. 

Not the point. If one can accept that not even bowing your head will not stop them from praying, and not holding their hands won't stop them from praying or holding other's hands, and I didn't demand they stop or not do it with others, it should not be a big deal to let me sit it out. 

I did NOT stop them from praying. Everyone is missing my point. I simply didn't want to hold hands or bow my head. I did not prevent others from doing that.

They still prayed and I didn't object to it. The only thing I objected to was them initially trying to hold my hand. When they started I was silent, I simply didn't bow my head or hold hands. 

Again, it was not a matter of stopping them at all. So everyone reading this needs to keep that in mind. It was a matter of once you know someone is not into something, it is annoying to have them continue to make the attempt to get you to partake in it. The funny thing is my friend after the meal was over, I explained that to him, and he was far more understanding than other theists.

I didn't pray.  Not the point, I should not have to bow my head or hold hands either. That is not being petty. If I invite someone over to my house, knowing they are not into a certain thing, even if just food, I don't offer it. Don't offer me your hand in that context. I can show you my affection and friendship with a hug or handshake and it would mean the same to me. They still prayed, they just did it without me in the circle.
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#14
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
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#15
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 11:05 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: [Image: 2n75gu.jpg]

This could be about anything while being a host, not just religion.

If you want people to come over, it isn't always about "I am king here". Even in business, it is about pleasing being the host.

People keep missing the fact that I even said, if I had been the host and it had been my house, I STILL WOULD HAVE LET THEM PRAY. I wish everyone would stop skipping over that. 

Sitting something out isn't going to kill them, or stop them from praying. And again, I didn't stop them, they still prayed. The only thing I didn't do was bow my head or hold hands. They still prayed. The only thing that annoyed me was the attempt to hold my hand. I had told them before I don't do that. It is no different than if I was the host of a party, and you said, "I don't like oysters" but I still cook them, I would still serve them to others, but would not offer them to the person who had already told me they don't like oysters. I don't like holding hands or bowing my head while others pray, that is not preventing anyone from doing that in front of me, merely for wanting to sit it out.
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#16
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
So, do you also have a fit if you go to someone's house who has the rule...no shoes in the house?

I really don't like that rule but if asked will comply since I am on their turf.

If I already know the 'no shoes rule' is a thing I will make sure I have socks on when I go there.

Seems to me since you keep saying these people are your friends you could have the conversation with them that you prefer not to be asked to join in their prayer circle. Then again, it may be that asking those around their table to join hands and pray is something so common to them that they give it no more thought than most of us do the 'thank you, you're welcome' routine that comes with most business transactions.

I figure you just needed to bitch...about your friends. You should really start that sort of rant with a disclaimer...something along the lines of....I don't care what you think, I just need to vent.
 “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe.” ~Albert Einstein                                                 
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#17
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 11:25 am)anjele Wrote: You should really start that sort of rant with a disclaimer...something along the lines of....I don't care what you think, I just need to vent.

Great

That's our Brian!

Why he hasn't gotten banned for derailing multiple threads with his rants is a mystery scientists are looking into at this very moment.
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#18
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 11:33 am)Jörmungandr Wrote:
(November 22, 2018 at 11:25 am)anjele Wrote: You should really start that sort of rant with a disclaimer...something along the lines of....I don't care what you think, I just need to vent.

Great

That's our Brian!  

Why he hasn't gotten banned for derailing multiple threads with his rants is a mystery scientists are looking into at this very moment.

Oh, I am quite familiar with Mr. Caps Lock.  He often posted the exact same things on TTA.  In fact, it was often the reason I came here in the past...to see if you guys were being graced with same stuff.
 “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe.” ~Albert Einstein                                                 
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#19
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 11:25 am)anjele Wrote: So, do you also have a fit if you go to someone's house who has the rule...no shoes in the house?

I really don't like that rule but if asked will comply since I am on their turf.

If I already know the 'no shoes rule' is a thing I will make sure I have socks on when I go there.

Seems to me since you keep saying these people are your friends you could have the conversation with them that you prefer not to be asked to join in their prayer circle.  Then again, it may be that asking those around their table to join hands and pray is something so common to them that they give it no more thought than most of us do the 'thank you, you're welcome' routine that comes with most business transactions.

I figure you just needed to bitch...about your friends.  You should really start that sort of rant with a disclaimer...something along the lines of....I don't care what you think, I just need to vent.

This is a long term picture in our species behavior. It is still about an unwritten assumption that because a majority does things a certain way, it is always good to assume it is "no big deal".

The funny thing is he just PMed me, just now, after I told him thanks for being understanding about why I didn't. So it is funny to me that people are less understanding here than the host I talked to about this very issue.

Now please stop missing that I have pointed out that I was the host, and it was my house, I would still let them pray. AND again, the only thing I objected to was offering me your hand, and expecting me to bow, after you know it is not my thing. 

It should not be a "big deal" if I don't hold hands or bow my head. Nobody here can point out where I demanded they don't pray at all. They still did. I would have been an asshole if I had said, "You cant do it yourselves". I didn't do that.
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#20
RE: Hanging out at a friends house last night.
(November 22, 2018 at 11:39 am)Brian37 Wrote:
(November 22, 2018 at 11:25 am)anjele Wrote: So, do you also have a fit if you go to someone's house who has the rule...no shoes in the house?

I really don't like that rule but if asked will comply since I am on their turf.

If I already know the 'no shoes rule' is a thing I will make sure I have socks on when I go there.

Seems to me since you keep saying these people are your friends you could have the conversation with them that you prefer not to be asked to join in their prayer circle.  Then again, it may be that asking those around their table to join hands and pray is something so common to them that they give it no more thought than most of us do the 'thank you, you're welcome' routine that comes with most business transactions.

I figure you just needed to bitch...about your friends.  You should really start that sort of rant with a disclaimer...something along the lines of....I don't care what you think, I just need to vent.

This is a long term picture in our species behavior. It is still about an unwritten assumption that because a majority does things a certain way, it is always good to assume it is "no big deal".

Bullcrap.
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