How about this..

[Deesse23]

Your (dishonest) switch from "closed loop solar plant" to steam turbine is noted.

bruh... go back and read it again.. The turbine is APART of a closed loop system. Even after I posted the definition you still refuse to read the truth! Not only that from my first post I included turbines of a nuclear power plant in a closed loop system 
ost 102
https://atheistforums.org/thread-59309-page-11.html

As far as energy now with things we have at hand.. Free nuclear power available to anyone anywhere in the world can be found just 7.5 miles down.
The deepest hole in the world is 7.5 mile down it is in russia. this hole was stopped at 7.5 miles because the water to cool the tools would flash before it got to the tool heads. meaning if we piped down water we could bring back up crazy high steam pressure. high enough to turn turbines and make conventional electricity..

So in a sense old sport... there is your perpetual motion machine. Just make it a closed loop system. Pump in cold water from a seal reservoir, down 7.5 miles have the water flash to steam allow the vapor to come back up as high pressure gas, run it through a turbine ,then a condenser then back to the radiator, and repeat.

No fuel used the turbine will spin till the steam washes away the stainless steel blades 100k years from now. the wate get pumped in as liquid turn to steam which forces it self out to the turbine via pipes runs through the turbine is recaptured by pipe system to a condenser making the water liquid again returns to a reservoir waiting to be used again. if the system is sealed then you will never need to refill the water nor need fuel to make the steam. 

Boom/mic drop.

This was my original statement. which only proves you have no idea what is going on. you are just flailing about lashing out at everything and saying anything that might help you in the moment despite what is actually being discussed..

Maybe you should go back to your one line contributions. less of a chance you will say something that i will want to make you take back later.

Dude, stop doing drugs!! Start to read wha tothers write, and reply to that, and start to read what the fuck you wrote yourself. You seem to have the attention span of a fruit fly.

I was refering to your solar plant, and you are answering about steam turbines? A steam turbine that is supposed to run till steam washes the blades away? Are you fucking triple mental?
You made a claim about a "closed loop solar plant". Where is the closed loop in a sun-fed solar plant?
And by the way, you just reposted your statement that the geothermal plant was a pmm, right after you acknowledged that pmms dont need to get fueled. You do not only not read other peoples´post you dont even read your own horseshit you wrote an hour ago.

One of you made the error means one of you made the mistake in assuming that i did not know fuel was the reason my machine was not PMM

Also:

Never Claimed i had a PPM

---

He’s an engineer in the same way a burger assembler is a manufacturing specialist.

Sanitary engineer possibly

[Anomalocaris]

Well, I just inform and share in a helpful matter. You, however, sputter around like a broken sprinkler hooked into a septic tank.

There might be something to my approach.

Eggo 23¼:  FSM spoketh: "Thou shall not be a dick"

Sorry to make you keep looking like a false prophet but there is no book of eggo
https://www.klps.pl/pliki/gospel_fsm_eng.pdf

however on page 80 you have the pastafarian guide to propaganda which in short tells us there is a rule against dogma.. Do you know this word dogma? it in part inspires those self righteous with the need to share the rules of your faith with others in a spam/unsolicited preaching way.

for instance this is a direct qute from the fsm bible

Know THAT YOU KNOW some of the science and history behind Pastafarianism, you may feel that you're ready to go out and spread His Word. With this in mind, it is important to remember that one of the central ideas of FSMism is the idea of inclusion. Anyone can be a member, no matter their age, race, background, or even their religious affiliation. As we've stated earlier, we do not base our beliefs on dogma—if we did, we'd have to think that we're absolutely right about everything. Only assholes think that way. And Pastafarians are not assholes.  

Making up books of the FSM bible just to tell someone they are wrong is being an asshole which is in direct violation of pastafarianism..

So again how are you not a false prophet?

At this point I being a christian are more of a pastafarian than you are.

---

You are wise beyond your years, Grasshopper.

Boru

seems both of you are gassy

---

Nuclear reactors aren’t perpetual motion machines either.

I have a ras unit in my greenhouse.  It’s a “closed loop” system which is also not a perpetual motion machine.  

The classification in both instances is a term of art, and doesn’t represent the reality of thermodynamics.

You’re the only person who made a mistake.  Every one of your posts just serves to prolong your own embarrasment.

- and just think of how many atheists have died and gone to hell while you embarrass yourself.

Could’ve been sharing the word of god, but that takes a backseat to the word of drich.

never said it was smartest guy on the website..

close loop does not make a PMM. it just made no exhaust or waste which fills one parameter of a PMM

Drich, a perpetual motion machine is not an machine that has unlimited fuel.   It is not a machine that is "closed loop",   a perpetual machine can be a machine which consumes no energy, does no work, but runs idlily forever;   or it can be a machine which consumes energy to do work but waste no energy whatsoever;  or it can be a machine which consumes no energy but does work.     Closed loop does not figure.

Your proposed machine consumes more energy, does less work, and waste energy in between.   In other words it fulfill the unique criteria for zero forms of perpetual motion machine.    Your machine is as much a perpetual motion machine as a lump of coal is a bar of gold.     You might think these criteria are not important, and certainly not as important as Drich's pretentions, which appears to us to be all important to you, and more important than even your god, for surely if it were not more important than your god you would be quaking in your boots for lying about having had AIDS.    But we don't care for your pretentions, we care for the criteria.

Your proposed machine, like all machines, consumes energy, waste some of it, and turn the rest to work.   Where you imagined you injected a unique spark of Drichian genius, is in the fact that the energy your machine consumes does not appear to you to be easily exhausted, and appear in your poorly researched plan to be cheaply accessible.    Had you continue to discuss these, we would have given you credit for being good intentioned, and might even think less harshly of you for trying to push your biblical shit here.

But with a mix of amazing stupidity and boundless conceit, you chose to die on the hill of why what is not a perpetual motion machine is a perpetual motion machine.   This does not advance your cause of impressing us with your insight and judgement so as to more easily hoist your biblical shit on us here, Drich.

[The Grand Nudger]

You’ve already been quoted, directly, claiming that it was.

Which one of you two assholes should we believe, Drich?

You, or you?

[I_am_not_mafia]

I don't believe for a second you are an engineer Drich. Here is what you have to do: you need to use proper words.

This is actually very important. And one reason why one should consider getting a formal education ... and that means learning from a teacher.

Why? Because it communicates to others that you know what you are talking about. They will be more likely to listen to you. No man is an island. You can't build a geothermal plant by yourself in your back garden (yard) for example.

And even if you know the language to use and have a formal education, even that may not be enough. Even if you have a brilliant idea which could revolutionise the world and have the knowledge and experience to see it through, you still have to sell it to others. But if no one else is interested because they aren't asking the right questions yet, or sees the value because of their preconceptions then the idea will die with you.

And if you can't even use the right language then you have virtually no chance.

[Drich]

Desse made the mistake assuming I did not know what closed loop meant in relation to power generation. He probably did a simple generic google search and a general electrical definition.. as he not being a legit engineer simply did not know any better.

You do not know anything about Deese. You are just assuming that he isn't a legitimate engineer because he does not agree with you (all the while not realising that no one agrees with you).

I work with engineers daily. deese is way way to closed minded and intentionally uninformed which in of itself is not his tell.. his tell is his lack of a basic vocabulary. you can not be anyone who has been educated or ever work on any more than one thing. He seems to know what he knows but it is like he worked one job and knows everything about his one task.

How can one who claims to know engineering ( a very broad field) fail to understand a term like close loop. it means something different in EVERY SINGLE DISCIPLINE of engineering and design. If you only worked on cars day in and day out you would know that word pertained to a car reading off it's sensors or working from a pre programmed set of parameters. OR in a car it could also be used to describe the air conditioning circuit. So he is not even a basic car mechanic or if he is he specializes in one part of the car which is not something a modern mechanic can only do. Because the word closed loop means something different in every discipline, an engineer would research the specific application before he commits or speaks. Engineers mind set is not to persume or assume but to align their work with know science or values. it is to take an idea and then research to proove his ideas are right. Desse would have researched closed loop power plants if he knew this is a generic term. which brings us to his second tell. he researches absolutely nothing. he assumes he knows it all. Take an honest look between all of the different citations links and video I align my ideas with, and then look at what he was able to produce when asked on several occasions.. the man never produced anything no matter how many times I asked him to cite something. engineers provide primary source material if not secondary when primary is not available.

Dude proble works on a cruise ship or a freighter.. they call allof their workers engineers.

Meanwhile you try to make an argument from authority because you are a refrigerator technician. And because no one else is doing the same you assume that it is because they cannot. This is an example of your arrogance.

again title aside look at the quality of response IE look at who produces citations links and videos and who can't produce a working definition of a word so as not to humiliate himself for a basic comprehension failure.

The truth is that there are many people on this forum far more qualified than you to talk about thermodynamics yet they do not make an argument from authority because they recognise that doing so is a fallacious argument.

THEN THEY SHOULD OR COULD HAVE SHUT ME DOWN Simply by telling me my machine uses fuel. but NONE not one of you qualified people who could have thermodynamically pounded me into the ground did so.. again this was not a one or two hour discussion.. I let this go one and on for 5 days to show you people how inept you where in researching and discussing scientific fact and existing technology.

5 days where any one of the experts you mention could have said "heydrich are you stupid or something? your plant used the earth's heat as fuel! did you not even look up the word PMM? it says it in the defination, the machine can not use fuel!!!" but... none of you even broached the subject.

(yes deesee used the word nuclear fuel because he thought I thought the ground 7.5 miles down was radioactive/read his post and follow up but that has nothing to do with why my machine is not PMM)

I would have let the discussion go on for a month if not for the fact you guys began to use arguments you where trying on day one. (circling back around hoping the old stuff would stick.) Then even after I let you in on it (the smart one immediately shut up) but the rest took another 7 days to finally get/accept what was done.

yet you say there are people here more qualified???


Fine let's go with that.. just riddle me this who are they and why didn't they speak up? why did they let the rest of you get gut hooked into a discussion where all of you look like... what you claim I am?

Not only that have you missed the point all together? it's not about school it is about backing what you say up with legit scientific fact, so even if there was a guy more qualified he still can not argue documented facts. That is what i did that is what I do. ALL THE TIME.

Also, because unlike you they do know their subject, they don't have to try convincing others to believe them.

until someone like me shows someone like deesee to be lying or completely ignorant completely destroying his credibility EVEN IF HE WAS A full on real life engineer. Why? because unlike what you group thinkers have been taught it is not about your pedigree it is about the truth and what you can prove. like I proved desse was 1000% wrong when he said closed loops systems have nothing to do with nuclear power. Do yu truly still not understand? Science and technology trumps what even a 'respected man' thinks or feels. Don't you guys use this on christians all of the time? How the hell can you let a christian then beat you with this same strategy???

I'm thinking that it's more than just a Dunning Kruger syndrome with you. You seem pathologically incapable of admitting either that you are wrong or do not know something. Even when it is pointed out to you in ways that cannot be refuted, you instead claim it was a deliberate move on your part to test us. You are fooling no one.

beloved.. show me where I was wrong.
show me where what I said did not match the science I posted.
Show me where my definition of closed loop was 'not used by the nuclear power industry show me where I was not right in how my initial machine was wrong..
(which btw just showed you to be a name calling ad hoc, liar.)
because IAM THE ONE who identified my machine as a non PMM, when you all proved that none of you knew enough basic science to shut me down/identify the fatal flaw in this design after 5 days That beloved is an admission of being wrong right there.

So now show me where any of you properly refuted anything I have said.. You WILL NOT AND CAN NOT. Why? because I like all engineers build arguments/things based on know and verifiable quantities and or facts. so if there is a failure it can be identified and fixed. I make up nothing on the fly I am disciplined and research everything. know it or not like it or not I'm usually 2 or 3 days ahead of most of you when speaking to you. why?

Because the smarter members have already gone down this road, and most of you write it off as incomprehensible drich dribble. but you gotta remember I am often times dealing with a dozen or more of you at a time and can 9times out of 10 address you where you are at in the conversation your failures your good points and mistakes without having to reference anything, while most of you struggle trying to keep up with me.. So how do I know I am right when I speak to you? because I researched it 3 days before when the question was first asked and was right then.

It is OK to admit that you do not know something or were wrong. We all have to do this at some point, why are you incapable of doing so yourself?

---

Could’ve been sharing the word of god, but that takes a backseat to the word of drich.

To be fair, we know that Drich exists.

Still waiting on that one.. ALL of you where wrong here not one of you has admitted it.

The best i've gotten from any of you is when you figure out what I've done... is you shut up and move on. but no admissions.

And again post 179 in the so what happened thread was me showing you when and how i was wrong. i even made an out line in this thread showing all of you how and why my reasoning failed.. remember why I said engineers research everything to align themselves with truths and known quanities so when it fails we can determine why. that out/time line was an failure analysis. Something you hero desse has yet to demonstrate or has done.

In the out line I went step by step and showed you all of the times I failed how and why I failed. I also showed you how all f yu failed and provided a synopsis of how and why also..

Something desee again has not done.

he/se is emotionally motivated and everything comes from the gut with that one. he/she communicates like a scolding parent on their say so. again no engineer works that way..

[The Grand Nudger]

Maybe you should run your pmm by your engineer buddies, lol.

[Drich]

People told you that you didn’t have a perpetual motion machine....drich, because you don’t.

Just like people are flat out laughing at you now, for bullshitting us about this being a game of 3D chess....because it isn’t.

@Mathilda

Nah, that’s not the systems fault.  Drich is the only person responsible for drich, lol.

GAE.. I said I did not have a PMM when none of you knew or could figure out why I did not have a PMM.. While you where picking your noses and calling me names I wrote out a complete failure analysis as to why I did not have a pmm. so who are you talking to i wonder? \

None of you could explain why my machine was not a pmm that was my point. all any of you did was call me names, and I brought the science simply to show you it was there! and you still haven't caught on.

---

Drich, nobody can help you if you don't want help, and you have made it clear you do not.

When someone offers to replace your kaleidoscope with a telescope, you can look at that as replacing two cans and a piece of string with a cell phone.

It was understandable in ALL OF ANTIQUITY worldwide, be it Christian, or Muslim or Jew or Hindu or ancient Egyptian or Roman or ancient Greek mythology. It was understandable back then when humans didn't know any better. We know better now.

so you are just going to stereotype me as a general christian so you do not have to answer my actual talking points... safe.. If i where you and did not want my beliefs challenge I would stick to safe platitudes that work on most stereotypical christians.

Just let me know if and when you are ready to examine your safe world view.

[The Grand Nudger]

Of all the pointless lies, bullshitting us about what you said in thread that exists, even after you’ve been quoted.......

Go run your pmm by your engineer buddies.

[Drich]

it does. for normal people starting from scratch.

I am clearly not starting from scratch. You maybe starting from scratch, but I know how just about everything in the modern world works. not an expert.. just have a general idea. 

I looked up design parameters by defining the machine. then put 20 years of design to work thinking of all the different was to create a self contained system that creates as much or more energy than it takes to propel the machine. first thing that came to mind was solar, but that uses the sun for fuel then geothermal which uses water trapped beneath the earth for fuel.

 then I had the idea of treating a geo thermal like a nuclear power plant IE making a closed loop system but I also know that water trapped will accumulate and need to be vented which at this point is waste other wise the plant could blow, because the water helps stabilize the fissure temp or magma coming to the surface.. (cut off the water it will run hotter like a melt down situation) 

then thought if it where further down.. then remembered seeing a video on the deepest hole ever dug. and remember they had to stop drilling because the water/mud they where using to keep the drill cool was turning to steam and at that level the rock is more like soft clay. temp is that hot 7.5 miles down and if we cut water in the closed loop nothing will happen that has not already happened. meaning it is safe to operate indefinitely.

So I purposed that finding out a day later that the earth's temp by this new definition I found would be considered fuel just like the sun is considered fuel for the solar array as a solar plant can not produce electricity with out the sun my hybrid plant can not produce electricity with out the heat of the earth.

I don't believe for a second you are an engineer Drich. Here is what you have to do: you need to use proper words. Exempli gratia: you can have an idea that is more efficient harnessing geothermal energy, like the machine you propose. Build one, show that it is more efficient than normal geothermal stations (don't forget to register a patent) and collect the moneys and laurels of your invention. Do not claim it a a perpetual motion machine, because it is impossible. The most efficient machine humans make is the electric transformer, has no moving parts, that is in the 95% efficiency, still there is a loss of energy via conductor resistance and the heat loss from that (ever wondered why those heat up , e.g.  your phone charger). An internal combustion engine like most cars, is in 35-40% efficiency range.

You are talking out of your ass. Take a course on physics please, it would do wonders about your understanding of these things.

be happy to give you a tour of my facility show you some patents.

[The Grand Nudger]

Got a patent for a pmm?