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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 12:39 am
(This post was last modified: November 19, 2019 at 12:42 am by Fireball.)
(November 18, 2019 at 10:52 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Nope. Training to exhaustion is fine. It's one of the more useful tools, especially now that you can't just beat the shit out of them. 80lb isn't even a random cruel number. It's what a full kit weighs.
Well, I know that as a beardless youth of 15, I carried composition shingles 10' up a ladder to the roof (in the snow, and into the wind  ) all day.
And the guys I know (admittedly few) that dropped with that kit buried a lot of it after they hit the ground.
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 7:41 am
(This post was last modified: November 19, 2019 at 7:42 am by Gawdzilla Sama.)
(November 18, 2019 at 10:09 pm)Fireball Wrote: (November 18, 2019 at 7:22 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: I teamed up with a Marine staff sergeant to make one of his troopers see the light once. He humped an 80 pound bag of concrete mix up and down a ramp until he crumbled. He was begging by the end.
This would appear to be an illegal order. You must be proud.
How would it be illegal?
(November 18, 2019 at 10:52 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Nope. Training to exhaustion is fine. It's one of the more useful tools, especially now that you can't just beat the shit out of them. 80lb isn't even a random cruel number. It's what a full kit weighs.
Amateurs talk torture, professionals talk training. 
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 8:42 am
(November 19, 2019 at 7:41 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: (November 18, 2019 at 10:09 pm)Fireball Wrote: This would appear to be an illegal order. You must be proud.
How would it be illegal?
(November 18, 2019 at 10:52 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Nope. Training to exhaustion is fine. It's one of the more useful tools, especially now that you can't just beat the shit out of them. 80lb isn't even a random cruel number. It's what a full kit weighs.
Amateurs talk torture, professionals talk training.
One of my brothers spent quite a lot of time in the BA (ending up as RSM) and he liked to say that training wasn't made harder than necessary - it was made as hard as possible, and on purpose.
Makes sense to me.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 8:49 am
The point to the exercise I mentioned above was to demonstrate to the slacker how bad it could be if he continued on his present path. Being ordered about by a sailor was the cherry on top.
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 8:53 am
(November 19, 2019 at 8:49 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: The point to the exercise I mentioned above was to demonstrate to the slacker how bad it could be if he continued on his present path. Being ordered about by a sailor was the cherry on top.
Yeah, I agree. I don't think that sort of thing qualifies as 'torture' in any way shape or form.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 9:07 am
(November 19, 2019 at 8:53 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: (November 19, 2019 at 8:49 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: The point to the exercise I mentioned above was to demonstrate to the slacker how bad it could be if he continued on his present path. Being ordered about by a sailor was the cherry on top.
Yeah, I agree. I don't think that sort of thing qualifies as 'torture' in any way shape or form.
Boru We used to discuss where the line was. We had all be snot-nosed kids at some point. We tested this generation to see who was going to be encouraged to stay on after their first hitch.
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 9:43 am
(This post was last modified: November 19, 2019 at 9:44 am by BrianSoddingBoru4.)
(November 19, 2019 at 9:07 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: (November 19, 2019 at 8:53 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Yeah, I agree. I don't think that sort of thing qualifies as 'torture' in any way shape or form.
Boru We used to discuss where the line was. We had all be snot-nosed kids at some point. We tested this generation to see who was going to be encouraged to stay on after their first hitch.
That's fair. Since there have to be soldiers, I'd think we'd want them as fit as humanly possibly. I don't see much ethical difference between running about with a sack of concrete and the typical 'Drop and give me twenty'. Other that the former is probably more effective as a disciplinary technique.
Or we could go back to flogging...
Boru
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 9:47 am
That would be against UCMJ.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 9:48 am
(November 19, 2019 at 9:47 am)Gae Bolga Wrote: That would be against UCMJ.
Flogging is against the rules? Seriously? Dafuq is the world coming to???
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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RE: To US Veterans...
November 19, 2019 at 9:51 am
(This post was last modified: November 19, 2019 at 9:56 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Right? Something very close to that sentiment was a common opinion among NCOs, though, when the hammer came down on assualt as a training enhancement or disciplinary tool. Leading to comments about the "New" and "Old" Army becoming idiomatic.
Used to be the case that, to become good at your job as an NCO, you memorized field manuals and hit the gym. Nowadays, you'll want to haul books back and forth to behavioral sciences. The old stereotypes don't fit with service's contemporary direction. Alot of that, to bring it back round, came out of experience with situations like the one that formed your opinion of service and soldiers. That way of doing things isn't just shitty, it doesn't work.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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