No dark matter?

[Wormhole199]

I'm sorry, but you can't use string theory to lend weight to the Quran.

To start with the comparison is ridiculous and secondly, string theory has yet to be proven and at the moment remains firmly fixed in the realm of metaphysics.

No need for String Theory. General relativity predicted gravitational lensing, that is, the gravitational field generated by a galaxy causes the light passing through it to bend (change direction). Dark Matter does not emit any light but we can still map its location by using gravitational lensing, that is, by detecting where light is bending in places where it shouldn't.

Since Dark Matter does not emit any light then we have to trace the light from the background galaxies. From the distances and the angle of lensing we estimate the mass of the Dark Matter. No angle no Dark Matter.

But this is exactly how the Quran challenges non-believers to find the seven superimposed heavens, by detecting where light gets bent in places where it shouldn't. Learn more: Seven Heavens in Quran

[Darwinian]

Sorry, I can't see any link between the two.

[lilphil1989]

But this is exactly how the Quran challenges non-believers to find the seven superimposed heavens, by detecting where light gets bent in places where it shouldn't. Learn more: Seven Heavens in Quran

It says nothing of the sort.
But I like how one of you is saying that the quran disproves the existence of dark matter whilst the other says it predicts it.
But when you're willing to make patently absurd interpretations, I suppose you can claim that it says anything you like.

If the quran says anything at all about dark matter, then Nostradamus predicted the diameter of my anal sphincter.

[Wormhole199]

But this is exactly how the Quran challenges non-believers to find the seven superimposed heavens, by detecting where light gets bent in places where it shouldn't. Learn more: Seven Heavens in Quran

It says nothing of the sort.

Really? Well that's because you never even visited the link I gave you: http://www.speed-light.info/miracles_of_...eavens.htm

Moslems say that this is how God challenges nonbelievers to detect the remaining six superimposed Heavens:

[Quran 67.3-4] [Allah] is the one who created seven superimposed Heavens "سبع سموات طباق". You do not see variations in the formations of the Compassionate, so redirect your sight, do you see any creation (Futtur in Arabic فطور)? Then redirect your sight again, your vision returns to you in defeat and regret.

Futtur in Arabic فطور means creation out of nothing (it does not mean "rip"). So the question in the Quran is "Do you see any creation out of nothing?". Your initial answer should be NO. But in the second verse, when you are supposed to redirect your sight your answer will change to YES, with defeat. Why should you redirect your sight when you observe Dark Matter? Why should you look to another direction and then back? Well the gravity of a massive object makes you see the background stars in another direction:

This is how we detect Dark Matter today, the background images are lensed at a certain angle. Since Dark Matter does not emit any light then we have to trace the light from the background galaxies. From the distances and the angle of lensing we estimate the mass of the Dark Matter. So when detecting the superimposed seven heavens you have to look away and then back in order to measure the angle. No angle no Dark Matter.

[lilphil1989]

[align=justify]

But this is exactly how the Quran challenges non-believers to find the seven superimposed heavens, by detecting where light gets bent in places where it shouldn't. Learn more: Seven Heavens in Quran

It says nothing of the sort.

Really? Well that's because you never even visited the link I gave you: http://www.speed-light.info/miracles_of_...eavens.htm

Yes, I did. The quran says nothing whatsoever about dark matter.

If you want to deliberately misinterpret what it does say, feel free, but don't expect anyone to take you seriously.

[JohnDG]

Who ever wrote the quran and predicted dark matter, must have just been on acid. That make's no sense what so ever.

[Napoléon]

like lilphil said, you can interpret these thing's any way you want. it's like twisting nostradamus's quatrains to suit certain events. many people think that he predicted 911 with his 'new city' quatrain but i've read it and really you could constrew it to any event you can think of.

the quran is just the same. unless it says explicitly 'DARK MATTER EXISTS' then you're just chatting absolute bollocks.

[Wormhole199]

the quran is just the same. unless it says explicitly 'DARK MATTER EXISTS' then you're just chatting absolute bollocks.

The Quran insists on seven superimposed heavens; every Moslem knows this. We are in the lowest heaven, Angels are in the seventh, and Satan (Jinn) is in one heaven in-between. However all seven heavens are superimposed. There are two angels at your shoulders right now. The Quran says that we cannot see them nor collide with them but we can detect their gravity. However these are the exact same properties of Dark Matter, we cannot see them nor collide with them however we can detect their gravity. String Theory explains what they are: They are mass in another dimension.

[Napoléon]

the quran is just the same. unless it says explicitly 'DARK MATTER EXISTS' then you're just chatting absolute bollocks.

The Quran insists on seven superimposed heavens; every Moslem knows this. We are in the lowest heaven, Angels are in the seventh, and Satan (Jinn) is in one heaven in-between. However all seven heavens are superimposed. There are two angels at your shoulders right now. The Quran says that we cannot see them nor collide with them but we can detect their gravity. However these are the exact same properties of Dark Matter, we cannot see them nor collide with them however we can detect their gravity. String Theory explains what they are: They are mass in another dimension.

BULLSHYTE. show me the fucking verses and i will show you how you have just constrewn your own version around words which are blatently fucking crap.

[lilphil1989]

The Quran insists on seven superimposed heavens; every Moslem knows this. We are in the lowest heaven, Angels are in the seventh, and Satan (Jinn) is in one heaven in-between. However all seven heavens are superimposed. There are two angels at your shoulders right now. The Quran says that we cannot see them nor collide with them but we can detect their gravity. However these are the exact same properties of Dark Matter, we cannot see them nor collide with them however we can detect their gravity. String Theory explains what they are: They are mass in another dimension.

[/align]

You don't need string theory to explain dark matter. All you need is some form of matter that doesn't interact electromagnetically.
I would say that the best candidate at the moment, by Occam's razor, at least until we know more are WIMPs. We already know that there are massive particles that only see the weak interaction and gravity: neutrinos. So all that we require is something like a heavy neutrino. Actually, if they had right-handed chirality, the wouldn't see the weak interaction either, and there you have it: something non-colliding (although collision isn't even a well-defined concept quantum-mechanically) and gravitationally interacting.

But I'm sure with enough imagination you could twist the words of the quran and claim that it predicts this too.


Plus, string theory has no experimental verification. As I've already said, at this point it's pure conjecture, and that will remail the case until it makes some solid experimental predictions.
What will happen if it makes predictions and they're falsified? You'll just reinterpret the verses and claim that they disprove string theory and that muslims knew that all along.