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No dark matter?
#31
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 6:09 am)Napoleon666 Wrote: BULLSHYTE. show me the fucking verses and i will show you how you have just constrewn your own version around words which are blatently fucking crap.

The seven superimposed heavens are all over the Quran. Actually the Islamic daily prayer starts with:

[Quran 1]1 In the name of Allah , the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful. [All] praise is to Allah , Lord of the worlds

"Lord of the worlds" in plural because they are seven superimposed heavens.

[Quran 17.44] The seven heavens and the Earth and everyone in them glorify Him [Allah]; and there is nothing that doesn't glorify HIM thankfully; but you (humans) do not understand their glorification. He is Compassionate, Merciful.

[Quran 16.49-50] And to Allah kneels what's in the heavens and what's on Earth, of land animals and angels, and they act with no arrogance; They fear their Lord above them and they do what they are ordered


My favorite site: Speed of Light.
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#32
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 7:29 am)Wormhole199 Wrote:
(April 22, 2011 at 6:09 am)Napoleon666 Wrote: BULLSHYTE. show me the fucking verses and i will show you how you have just constrewn your own version around words which are blatently fucking crap.

The seven superimposed heavens are all over the Quran. Actually the Islamic daily prayer starts with:

[Quran 1]1 In the name of Allah , the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful. [All] praise is to Allah , Lord of the worlds

"Lord of the worlds" in plural because they are seven superimposed heavens.

[Quran 17.44] The seven heavens and the Earth and everyone in them glorify Him [Allah]; and there is nothing that doesn't glorify HIM thankfully; but you (humans) do not understand their glorification. He is Compassionate, Merciful.

[Quran 16.49-50] And to Allah kneels what's in the heavens and what's on Earth, of land animals and angels, and they act with no arrogance; They fear their Lord above them and they do what they are ordered



so what does this seven superimposed heavens prove? i never doubted that the quran didnt mention it but you're claiming the quran talks about dark matter. where is this? fucking idiot.

and one line about these 7 heavens is all the basis you need to start talking about what lives on what level? i really don't see how you get from one to the other.
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#33
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 7:36 am)Napoleon666 Wrote: so what does this seven superimposed heavens prove? i never doubted that the quran didnt mention it but you're claiming the quran talks about dark matter. where is this? fucking idiot.

and one line about these 7 heavens is all the basis you need to start talking about what lives on what level? i really don't see how you get from one to the other.

First, mind your language.

Second, this mysterious Dark Matter is invisible however it provides the bulk of gravity that holds galaxies (not the regular matter that forms stars and planets). This invisible Dark Matter has weird collision properties (collisionless). Simply put: we cannot see Dark Matter nor collide with it but we can detect its gravity.

In this image, two huge clusters of invisible Dark Matter (in blue) clashed with each other:

[Image: seven_heavens.jpg]

With each cluster having a mass of 10,000 galaxies (each cluster a quadrillion times the mass of the Sun, 10^15!!!) (See: Universe Today). However upon impact, instead of disintegrating into smaller pieces, they passed through each other unscathed! This means that they did not collide with each other either! They simply passed through each other!!!

In String Theory they are mass in different dimensions. In the Quran they are mass in the superimposed seven heavens.
My favorite site: Speed of Light.
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#34
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 7:55 am)Wormhole199 Wrote:


"Collision" is not really a meaningful concept for thing which don't interact electromagnetically, as dark matter doesn't seem to do.


Quote:In String Theory they are mass in different dimensions. In the Quran they are mass in the superimposed seven heavens.

Nope, not true. You can quite easily build a string theory in which dark matter is a sterile neutrino or a light supersymmetric partner such as a neutralino.


And you still haven't addressed the fact that there is no evidence for string theory.
If we can find an experimental prediction that's consistent across different string theories, and that prediction doesn't agree with reality, string theory will be falsified.

If this happens will you concede that the quran is incorrect?

Galileo was a man of science oppressed by the irrational and superstitious. Today, he is used by the irrational and superstitious who claim they are being oppressed by science - Mark Crislip
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#35
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 8:21 am)lilphil1989 Wrote:
Quote:In String Theory they are mass in different dimensions. In the Quran they are mass in the superimposed seven heavens.

Nope, not true. You can quite easily build a string theory in which dark matter is a sterile neutrino or a light supersymmetric partner such as a neutralino.


And you still haven't addressed the fact that there is no evidence for string theory.

In this video, Prof. Michio Kaku, a leading figure in String Theory, says that Dark Matter is mass in the extra dimensions of String Theory:



And the 3D map of Dark Matter, that he referred to, mapped by gravitational lensing is here:



My favorite site: Speed of Light.
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#36
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 9:02 am)Wormhole199 Wrote: In this video, Prof Michio Kaku, a leading figure in String Theory, says that Dark Matter is mass in the extra dimensions of String Theory:

That's one way to build dark matter into a string theory.

These pop-sci string theory people aggravate me somewhat, because they don't make it at all clear that what they're saying is currently just conjecture, and the public comes away from a tv program such as this with the notion that string theory is as solid a scientific theory as, say, general relativity or quantum mechanics, which simply isn't true.

btw Michio Kaku is not so much a "leading figure in string theory" anymore, he hasn't published anything in the literature for over 10 years.
Just a small gripe, but it shouldn't matter too much, because we're not making an argument from authority are we? Wink


You haven't answered my question.
If at some point in the future string theory is falsified, will you concede that the quran is incorrect?
Galileo was a man of science oppressed by the irrational and superstitious. Today, he is used by the irrational and superstitious who claim they are being oppressed by science - Mark Crislip
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#37
RE: No dark matter?
(April 21, 2011 at 10:50 am)Wormhole199 Wrote: [Quran 67.3-4] [Allah] is the one who created seven superimposed Heavens "سبع سموات طباق". You do not see variations in the formations of the Compassionate, so redirect your sight, do you see any creation (Futtur in Arabic فطور)? Then redirect your sight again, your vision returns to you in defeat and regret.
]

That little bit of poetry could be made to mean one of a number of things.
Its very very vague.
'variations in the formations of the compassionate' I dispair sometimes I really do.
Devil



You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.

Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.




 








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#38
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 10:03 am)lilphil1989 Wrote: You haven't answered my question. If at some point in the future string theory is falsified, will you concede that the quran is incorrect?

I already said that we don't need String Theory. The challenge in the Quran is that you will find the seven superimposed heavens where light changes direction; this is gravitational lensing. I can assure you Dark Matter and gravitational lensing are here to stay.
My favorite site: Speed of Light.
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#39
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 1:37 pm)Wormhole199 Wrote:
(April 22, 2011 at 10:03 am)lilphil1989 Wrote: You haven't answered my question. If at some point in the future string theory is falsified, will you concede that the quran is incorrect?

I already said that we don't need String Theory. The challenge in the Quran is that you will find the seven superimposed heavens where light changes direction; this is gravitational lensing. I can assure you Dark Matter and gravitational lensing are here to stay.

Why, because your notion of how the Koran must be true demands it?

What in your option does your Koran need, but which is falsifiable, in order to be true?


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#40
RE: No dark matter?
(April 22, 2011 at 1:37 pm)Wormhole199 Wrote: I already said that we don't need String Theory.

*ahem*

Quote:In this video, Prof Michio Kaku, a leading figure in String Theory, says that Dark Matter is mass in the extra dimensions of String Theory:

Quote:In String Theory they are mass in different dimensions. In the Quran they are mass in the superimposed seven heavens.

Thinking


(April 22, 2011 at 1:37 pm)Wormhole199 Wrote: The challenge in the Quran is that you will find the seven superimposed heavens where light changes direction; this is gravitational lensing. I can assure you Dark Matter and gravitational lensing are here to stay.

It says nothing about light, nothing about gravity and nothing about dark matter.
If you're genuinely convinced by dishonest interpretation of a verse that's extremely vague to begin with, then you're too credulous by far and probably need to work on your critical thinking skills.
Galileo was a man of science oppressed by the irrational and superstitious. Today, he is used by the irrational and superstitious who claim they are being oppressed by science - Mark Crislip
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