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Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 10:58 am
(This post was last modified: October 3, 2020 at 11:39 am by BrianSoddingBoru4.)
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Boru
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 11:01 am
Craig borders on trump's level of stupidity.
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 11:06 am
(This post was last modified: October 3, 2020 at 11:07 am by Duty.)
The teleological argument is intellectually vacuous rubbish which is obviated by the fact of evolution through natural selection, beginning in all likelihood with protobiotic molecules created in the warm, weird and wonderful proximity of hydrothermal vents circa 4,000,000,000 years ago. Game over WLC et al.
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 11:25 am
(October 3, 2020 at 10:58 am)JAG Wrote: we Christians hold that we can know Christianity to be true
based upon the inner witness of the Holy Spirit that lives in us and tells us that
Christianity is true.
But what is your stance towards people of other religions who claim to witnesses and feel gods of their religions that have nothing to do with Christianity?
Here's how George Harrison, the guitarist for the Beatles described his relationship with god Krishna:
"If there’s a God, I want to see Him. It’s pointless to believe in something without proof, and Krishna Consciousness and meditation are methods where you can actually obtain GOD perception. You can actually see God, and Hear Him, play with Him. It might sound crazy, but He is actually there, actually with you."
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 11:36 am
The difference between atheists and theists.
Theist: "God created the universe. Noone created God. God has always been."
Atheist: "Man created god. The universe has always been".
We can see the universe.
Your god? Strangely absent.
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 11:43 am
(This post was last modified: October 3, 2020 at 11:43 am by GrandizerII.)
OP, you understand revelation doesn't mean anything epistemologically to us atheists here, no?
As far as I'm concerned, I have not been given any good reason to accept that you know with certainty that Christianity is true. Partly because saying that you bear the witness of the Holy Spirit within you means nothing to me. It's an empty claim to me.
As for this:
Quote:For example, the Teleological Argument for the existence of God seeks to establish probability based on the obvious order, design, and complexity that we see in the natural world, in the human body, in the Hubble Deep Field, and for that matter on the shelves of Walmart and Sam's Club --- all evidence of endless variety of products made from endless varieties of raw materials. Intelligent Design.
Two issues with this argument at first glance:
1) It is begging the question to presume actual design and then conclude from that the existence of God.
2) Order/complexity is not evidence that conclusively favors intelligent design over otherwise. Some things like the items on the shelves of Walmart and such are intelligently designed, while other things like planets and mountains and dinosaurs are/were probably not. Knowing which is this or that comes down to what we know about each of these things, not to some overgeneralized fallacious argument.
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 3, 2020 at 12:08 pm
At work.
Well.... helloooo to the forums at large JAG. 
Though I'll add that Mr Craig's works have been rather rehashed add nauseam here abouts.
That he doesn't understand enough biochemistry to fathom the errors in his "Odds are against" is also a 'Thing'.
All the best to you and yours.
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 4, 2020 at 6:53 am
(October 3, 2020 at 10:58 am)JAG Wrote: Moderator Notice
Post Deleted. You have previously posted this exact text on at least two other websites.
LOL, really? Does this guy think that "I can feel God therefore God exists" is such a good argument that he's been posting it "all over" Internet?! I guess this happens when people read some religious book (in this case by WLC) but fail to read some book with opposing arguments.
If you're a Christian, and you want to spread God on atheist websites, it would be very helpful, to say at least, to read the opposing opinion first to get to know what you are getting yourself into.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 4, 2020 at 7:07 am
(October 4, 2020 at 6:53 am)Fake Messiah Wrote: (October 3, 2020 at 10:58 am)JAG Wrote: Moderator Notice
Post Deleted. You have previously posted this exact text on at least two other websites.
LOL, really? Does this guy think that "I can feel God therefore God exists" is such a good argument that he's been posting it "all over" Internet?! I guess this happens when people read some religious book (in this case by WLC) but fail to read some book with opposing arguments.
If you're a Christian, and you want to spread God on atheist websites, it would be very helpful, to say at least, to read the opposing opinion first to get to know what you are getting yourself into.
You’re so silly. Christians proselytizers already know everything they need to know about atheists - we’re hopelessly immoral, we’re all committed Marxists, we burn churches, murder infants, don’t know right from wrong, hate God, want to end Christmas, and clearly have never read the Bible.
Studying up on atheism would be a waste of their valuable time, what with all those doorbells to ring and lawsuits to file.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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RE: Good Arguments (Certainty vs. Probability)
October 4, 2020 at 7:15 am
(This post was last modified: October 4, 2020 at 7:17 am by The Grand Nudger.)
FWIW, any notion that god exists (or any notion about anything at all) which is informed by some observed effect is categorically superior to any notion uninformed by the same.
I'd wonder whether the OP had ever considered that they might have the relationship backwards. Feeling is a god-making property, gods are not feeling-making agents. If there were no human feeling there would be no gods, but if there were no gods there is still human feeling - feeling is the incontrovertible fact referenced in argument, after all.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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