Who was Jesus?

[Ahriman]

I can only speak for myself, but I've called upon the name of Jesus a number of times, and been saved from distress. One time, while I was at a food bank, trying to get some food, there was a family ahead of me in the queue, and I was really starving, and I wanted the family to hurry up and leave so I could get my food, and I said, in a quiet voice, "Help me, Jesus", and the father of the family suddenly said, "You know what, that's enough for us, let's get out of here", and the family left within 30 seconds, so I was able to get some food. I would consider that a miracle.

You consider it a miracle that you offended them to the point where they went hungry,  ..... but you got your food. Halleluia.

It's a dog eat dog world. That's not my fault.

[The Grand Nudger]

Whose is it, who made the world this way? Who has the power to make the world elsewise? The author of creation would seem to be implicated in this state of affairs. I sometimes like to think of human superstition- generously- as the divine trying to learn on the job, correcting previous missteps while operating within it's (apparently) limited power.

Insomuch as I recognize that human superstition about the divine is, truly, about us, I can see how that might be both true, and why our superstitious narratives have developed in the manner that they have. With gods coming to make successive improvements, working on the curb appeal of our world.

[Ahriman]

I can only speak for myself, but I've called upon the name of Jesus a number of times, and been saved from distress. One time, while I was at a food bank, trying to get some food, there was a family ahead of me in the queue, and I was really starving, and I wanted the family to hurry up and leave so I could get my food, and I said, in a quiet voice, "Help me, Jesus", and the father of the family suddenly said, "You know what, that's enough for us, let's get out of here", and the family left within 30 seconds, so I was able to get some food. I would consider that a miracle.

Your standards for what is miraculous are pitiful.

A miracle doesn't always have to be some grandiose thing.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

I can only speak for myself, but I've called upon the name of Jesus a number of times, and been saved from distress. One time, while I was at a food bank, trying to get some food, there was a family ahead of me in the queue, and I was really starving, and I wanted the family to hurry up and leave so I could get my food, and I said, in a quiet voice, "Help me, Jesus", and the father of the family suddenly said, "You know what, that's enough for us, let's get out of here", and the family left within 30 seconds, so I was able to get some food. I would consider that a miracle.

The trouble with that is, you can never know if the family ahead of you wouldn’t have left anyway if you had sacrificed a goat to Asmodeus, muttered a cantrip to the Earth Mother. Or done nothing. Post hoc ergo propter hoc is always a fallacy.

Boru

[Ahriman]

Whose is it, who made the world this way?  Who has the power to make the world elsewise?

The answer is, and always has been, humans.

[Bucky Ball]

There are scientific studies that conclusively demonstrate prayer doesn't work. Those who think otherwise are delusional.
One person's opinion is nothing but anecdotes. It's not evidence. Correlation is not causation.
There is one that shows that New York heart surgery patients who get prayed for, do worse than those who have no prayers.

Actually the "do unto others " thing actually was around in Hebrew thought before Jesus, (it was not his idea),
but it wasn't really popular until after the temple was destroyed, and later when the rabbis were trying to figure out where Judaism was
going with no temple, and certainly after Jerusalem was destroyed in the bar Kochba revolt and no "center" at all left.

---

Whose is it, who made the world this way?  Who has the power to make the world elsewise?

The answer is, and always has been, humans.

So then, not Jesus. 
Thank you.
He did say if you ask for anything in his name, it would be given. You think the Haitians are not praying ?

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Whose is it, who made the world this way?  Who has the power to make the world elsewise?

The answer is, and always has been, humans.

And yet it took Jesus to make the queue move a little quicker.

Boru

Edit: Ninja’d 

[The Grand Nudger]

Whose is it, who made the world this way?  Who has the power to make the world elsewise?

The answer is, and always has been, humans.

ding ding ding...

So who, then, is behind the family in front of you getting out of the way so that you could belly up to the trough?  People, or some line god? Was it a miracle, or was it people being people, even in your own retelling? There's the miracle, I guess, if we value miracles even if those miracles don't proceed from some silly ghost.

Do we value miracles, or do we only see or value then when and if they inform us of a god?

[Ahriman]

There are scientific studies that conclusively demonstrate prayer doesn't work. Those who think otherwise are delusional.
One person's opinion is nothing but anecdotes. It's not evidence. Correlation is not causation.
There is one that shows that New York heart surgery patients who get prayed for, do worse than those who have no prayers.

Actually the "do unto others " thing actually was around in Hebrew thought before Jesus, (it was not his idea),
but it wasn't really popular until after the temple was destroyed, and later when the rabbis were trying to figure out where Judaism was
going with no temple, and certainly after Jerusalem was destroyed in the bar Kochba revolt and no "center" at all left.

---

The answer is, and always has been, humans.

So then, not Jesus. 
Thank you.
He did say if you ask for anything in his name, it would be given. You think the Haitians are not praying ?

Well Jesus isn't God. He can only do so much.

[The Grand Nudger]

-and that right there suggests that you aren't a christian and aren't talking about what a god could do or did do, even for you. We don't really disagree, you chose to engage in pious prattle.

Why?