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On the lunacy of free will
RE: On the lunacy of free will
That's interesting, could you describe some of this intellectual rigor that goes into the beliefs of teens and pre teens?
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
(October 15, 2021 at 4:03 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: That's interesting, could you describe some of this intellectual rigor that goes into the beliefs of teens and pre teens?

I can tell you about more intellectual rigor that comes out of my dog's ass than Ahriman can give you about just about anything.  And I can guarantee you he won't respond with anything resembling a real answer.
Why is it so?
~Julius Sumner Miller
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
(October 15, 2021 at 2:48 pm)Ahriman Wrote: It takes more courage to accept something for the sake of domestic tranquility, than to go the other way (so to speak) and be different from the norm.

This has to be one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard and goes against all evidence and common sense.

Growing up I have met many "supposedly" Christian teens and young people who go to Christian groups and church purely BECAUSE they don't have the courage to tell their parents / friends / family that they don't believe in God, would have to face massive amounts of conflict with said people, be subject to trying to be "cured" of their non-belief and in severe cases rejected / shunned, rather than be accepted for it.  In other words, they are choosing the easy (and in their mind the only) option as a dependent young person.

It is not just the courage it takes to face that level of opposition, but also the guilt that comes from going against everything you have been raised to believe is good, moral, and right by the people who have instilled your values in you from birth.

When I was going to church groups while growing up the number of people who went to these groups simply because it was the acceptable thing to do, but who were quite open amongst their friends within those groups about their "real" beliefs or lack of was very high, and that makes me very sad.

Coming out atheist in a devout family is probably equivalent to coming out gay in a family environment that considers homosexuality as a sin, and is likely to irredeemably damage families. It is a huge decision / cross to bear (excuse pun) for a young person.
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
(October 15, 2021 at 10:37 am)Ahriman Wrote:
(October 15, 2021 at 9:09 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Interestingly enough , "jesus" didn't.  That was an effect of romanization, as I think we've discussed.  At any rate..and since you have a pronounced "many people believe" habit...many people can be wrong.

There is no afterlife.  No heaven, no hell.  These are thematic elements of greek tragedy that got rolled into christian belief in the scuffle for political power in rome.
If most people believe in something, how likely is it that they're all wrong? Versus how likely it is that the naysayers are wrong?

Just because most Republicans believe that the 2020 election was stolen does not make it so. People have not just come to the belief of a Christian God through chance or personal discovery. There is a gigantic, organised system here designed to indoctrinate (from birth no less), and keep people believing a particular interpretation of a magic book belonging to a particular denomination of monotheism. The fact that this system has been extremely successful (over the centuries / millennia) in doing this, often on pain of death, says absolutely nothing as to the accuracy of it's assertions. 

I would agree to some extent if you had a lot of people coming to the exact same conclusion independently, with no undue pressure to do this either socially, physically or financially. but that is far from what is happening with organised religion. Can you not see the difference?

(October 15, 2021 at 3:07 pm)Ahriman Wrote: Well it's not so much that I "rejected Catholicism" as I just don't practice the religion anymore. I didn't reject everything about it.

How can you just not practice Catholicism? You either believe it, or you don't. If you do believe its messages, and choose not to follow it, you are an idiot, as the perceived repercussions for you would be severe. (I guess just as you wouldn't let anyone else you care about not practice it either.... since that would be inhumane... It would be the equivalent of knowing about a train crash and not telling your fellow passengers to get off at the preceding stop, no? etc)
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
There's also the fact that continuing to pretend to believe in (name religion), in essence pretending to be someone you are not, is extremely mentally unhealthy and can cause serious emotional issues throughout life.

Actually in the Catholic faith, going through the motions is more important than believing. For protestants, that belief in Jesus is what gets you saved from hell even if you go out later and kill your wife, but Catholicism is a bit different. You are expected to participate, to be a good Catholic. Belief is sort of a side-effect of that. It's sort of assumed that god exists but if someone is struggling with it, they just need to focus on the rituals and that shit will go away, or not, doesn't matter, just keep doing the rituals.

The thing about Ahriman is that he/she/it is not being honest here. His responses reek of dishonesty and subterfuge. He says one thing then contradicts it later. I'm convinced this is nothing but a troll that is working this forum for pleasure. Notice how he never, ever answers questions, only spouts a different controversial statement, often directly contradicting the last one. To whit: He's not a Christian, he's an ex-Catholic, he doesn't believe in god, he didn't leave the faith completely, he defends Christians and asserts nonsense about atheists.
This is definitely a troll.
Why is it so?
~Julius Sumner Miller
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
Oh well I definitely believe in God.
"Imagination, life is your creation"
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
(October 17, 2021 at 8:18 am)Spongebob Wrote: There's also the fact that continuing to pretend to believe in (name religion), in essence pretending to be someone you are not, is extremely mentally unhealthy and can cause serious emotional issues throughout life.

Actually in the Catholic faith, going through the motions is more important than believing.  For protestants, that belief in Jesus is what gets you saved from hell even if you go out later and kill your wife, but Catholicism is a bit different.  You are expected to participate, to be a good Catholic.  Belief is sort of a side-effect of that.  It's sort of assumed that god exists but if someone is struggling with it, they just need to focus on the rituals and that shit will go away, or not, doesn't matter, just keep doing the rituals.

The thing about Ahriman is that he/she/it is not being honest here.  His responses reek of dishonesty and subterfuge.  He says one thing then contradicts it later.  I'm convinced this is nothing but a troll that is working this forum for pleasure.  Notice how he never, ever answers questions, only spouts a different controversial statement, often directly contradicting the last one.  To whit:  He's not a Christian, he's an ex-Catholic, he doesn't believe in god, he didn't leave the faith completely, he defends Christians and asserts nonsense about atheists.
This is definitely a troll.

The most effective thing to do is to just not respond to Airhead. When it isn't fun any more he will move on to another forum.
  
“If you are the smartest person in the room, then you are in the wrong room.” — Confucius
                                      
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
Quote:Notice how he never, ever answers questions, only spouts a different controversial statement, often directly contradicting the last one.
Have you considered that I'm just not that intelligent? I never claimed intelligence is my strong suit. I'm not right about everything. But see here's the thing, even if I'm not right about everything, I should still speak as if I'm right about everything, because that's how you win at life. It's like an intellectual loop hole, and it upsets people like you. I have nothing to prove to anybody.
"Imagination, life is your creation"
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
At work.
(October 17, 2021 at 11:32 am)Ahriman Wrote: Have you considered that I'm just not that intelligent?

I should still speak as if I'm right about everything, because that's how you win at life....

.... I have nothing to prove to anybody.

The emboldened comments? They appear to be contradictory/mutually exclusive.

Now as for the first sentence?

Hey, I'll admit to not being the sharpest spork in the drawer either. So instead of possibly posturing? Perhapse ask for help/clarification?

Cheers.
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RE: On the lunacy of free will
(October 17, 2021 at 11:32 am)Ahriman Wrote:
Quote:Notice how he never, ever answers questions, only spouts a different controversial statement, often directly contradicting the last one.
Have you considered that I'm just not that intelligent? I never claimed intelligence is my strong suit. I'm not right about everything. But see here's the thing, even if I'm not right about everything, I should still speak as if I'm right about everything, because that's how you win at life. It's like an intellectual loop hole, and it upsets people like you. I have nothing to prove to anybody.

bold mine

This was worth the pain - laughing with a broken rib isn't pleasant but this required a laugh.
  
“If you are the smartest person in the room, then you are in the wrong room.” — Confucius
                                      
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