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Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 11:23 am
Just wondering if there was anyone who wanted to explain free will in reference to the existence of god and why suffering is a thing that exists for all eternity according to Christianity but god did it so its ok? I keep running into self proclaimed Christains who claim god "isnt like that" and they don't believe in Hell.
Isn't that like having your cake and eating it too? There's an entire book dedicated to it in the New Testament after all..
May not be a new topic for you but I want to refresh my memory on the subject with anyone (within reason) whose interested.
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 11:36 am
Easy to explain.... it's all made up BS!
The meek shall inherit the Earth, the rest of us will fly to the stars.
Never underestimate the power of very stupid people in large groups
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 11:43 am
(October 30, 2022 at 11:36 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Easy to explain.... it's all made up BS!
Thank you, yes, but not to tens of millions or billions of people around the globe it isn't and the repercussions of that is a thread in and of itself!
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 1:20 pm
Free will intersects theism at multiple points. It's not clear which specific questions you'd like addressed.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 1:24 pm
(October 30, 2022 at 11:23 am)Mystical Wrote: Just wondering if there was anyone who wanted to explain free will in reference to the existence of god and why suffering is a thing that exists for all eternity according to Christianity but god did it so its ok? I keep running into self proclaimed Christains who claim god "isnt like that" and they don't believe in Hell.
Isn't that like having your cake and eating it too? There's an entire book dedicated to it in the New Testament after all..
May not be a new topic for you but I want to refresh my memory on the subject with anyone (within reason) whose interested.
The Christian logic is usually along the lines of "God wants you to make a free choice". This runs into trouble under Calvinism, because of predestination, though.
"When you get the message, hang up the phone" --Alan Watts on enlightenment. 
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 1:45 pm
Free will under an omniscient, omnipotent god is problematic, to say the least.
To say the most, it’s incoherent.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 1:55 pm
(October 30, 2022 at 11:43 am)Mystical Wrote: (October 30, 2022 at 11:36 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Easy to explain.... it's all made up BS!
Thank you, yes, but not to tens of millions or billions of people around the globe it isn't and the repercussions of that is a thread in and of itself!
Christianity is a multidimensional rainbow. There is not one "Christianity" but many.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 2:28 pm
(October 30, 2022 at 1:24 pm)Orbit Wrote: (October 30, 2022 at 11:23 am)Mystical Wrote: Just wondering if there was anyone who wanted to explain free will in reference to the existence of god and why suffering is a thing that exists for all eternity according to Christianity but god did it so its ok? I keep running into self proclaimed Christains who claim god "isnt like that" and they don't believe in Hell.
Isn't that like having your cake and eating it too? There's an entire book dedicated to it in the New Testament after all..
May not be a new topic for you but I want to refresh my memory on the subject with anyone (within reason) whose interested.
The Christian logic is usually along the lines of "God wants you to make a free choice". This runs into trouble under Calvinism, because of predestination, though.
Ah yes the "god can count the numbers of hairs on your head and knows EVERYTHING" part. Hmmm.. ok ok good point.
Agrboda this is kind of what I'm looking for. Idiosyncrasies within the belief in free will and an omnipotent god.
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 2:28 pm
(October 30, 2022 at 1:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: (October 30, 2022 at 11:43 am)Mystical Wrote: Thank you, yes, but not to tens of millions or billions of people around the globe it isn't and the repercussions of that is a thread in and of itself!
Christianity is a multidimensional rainbow. There is not one "Christianity" but many.
Isn't that a problem? I think that's a problem.
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
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RE: Free will and the necessary evil
October 30, 2022 at 2:45 pm
(October 30, 2022 at 2:28 pm)Mystical Wrote: (October 30, 2022 at 1:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: Christianity is a multidimensional rainbow. There is not one "Christianity" but many.
Isn't that a problem? I think that's a problem.
Agreed.
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