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Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 1:56 pm
OK, reaching out to my agnostic/atheist friends. I'm very curious, genuinely interested, are there are "arguments" that theists have provided for proof of a God's existence (not even the Christian God), that you found compelling? Or caused you to pause and perhaps say, there might be A God out there?
I found that when it's all broken down in most debates, an agnostic/atheist boils down to moral arguments/judgments against God, which in and of themselves does not disprove there being a God per se. Just that they refuse to accept a God they find reprehensible.
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 1:59 pm
(This post was last modified: May 12, 2023 at 2:01 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
No. Kind of a double whammy, right? I have no reason to believe that these gods exist and they're all moral trash as the faithful tell it. Looks like it's rubbed off on you, too. The OP insinuates that anyone who doesn't believe the silly shit you believe..is fronting. Let's be honest.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:02 pm
Raised Catholic, I didn't ever really buy into the belief. In my late teens and early 20s I really thought I HAD to believe in something and perhaps that was another faith that spoke to me. I read and searched and tried but nothing really 'took' with me. If I ever see an argument that I find compelling, I will look into it.
“If you are the smartest person in the room, then you are in the wrong room.” — Confucius
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:09 pm
(May 12, 2023 at 1:59 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: No. Kind of a double whammy, right? I have no reason to believe that these gods exist and they're all moral trash as the faithful tell it. Looks like it's rubbed off on you, too. The OP insinuates that anyone who doesn't believe the silly shit you believe..is fronting. Let's be honest.
I'm not clear how my post insinuated anything of the sort. I simply asked if there was any argument given that caused you to pause and believe there to believe in a deity. Einstein's Spinoza God as an example. Rejection of religion, indoctrination, God of the Bible, but was a deist in terms of there seems to be an intelligent being out there responsible for what we see/experience.
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:11 pm
(May 12, 2023 at 2:02 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: Raised Catholic, I didn't ever really buy into the belief. In my late teens and early 20s I really thought I HAD to believe in something and perhaps that was another faith that spoke to me. I read and searched and tried but nothing really 'took' with me. If I ever see an argument that I find compelling, I will look into it.
Appreciate that candor, AWTY. Intellectually honest. If something is compelling it's worth looking in to. Most people do not go that far, especially if they don't WANT what they are hearing to actually be true given the logical conclusions of its outworking.
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:22 pm
(May 12, 2023 at 2:09 pm)Kingpin Wrote: (May 12, 2023 at 1:59 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: No. Kind of a double whammy, right? I have no reason to believe that these gods exist and they're all moral trash as the faithful tell it. Looks like it's rubbed off on you, too. The OP insinuates that anyone who doesn't believe the silly shit you believe..is fronting. Let's be honest.
I'm not clear how my post insinuated anything of the sort. I simply asked if there was any argument given that caused you to pause and believe there to believe in a deity. Einstein's Spinoza God as an example. Rejection of religion, indoctrination, God of the Bible, but was a deist in terms of there seems to be an intelligent being out there responsible for what we see/experience.
You know, I believe that wholeheartedly. Just like I believe you don't see how you continue the same in the response to another poster above. Yet another demerit for this whole business?
Spinoza was an atheist who had his work published posthumously...for reasons. No, I don't find that a spinozan philosophy makes me think a god does or might exist, and it's pretty clear spinoza didn't either.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:23 pm
Never found any convincing evidence for the existance of gods
The meek shall inherit the Earth, the rest of us will fly to the stars.
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:33 pm
(May 12, 2023 at 2:22 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: (May 12, 2023 at 2:09 pm)Kingpin Wrote: I'm not clear how my post insinuated anything of the sort. I simply asked if there was any argument given that caused you to pause and believe there to believe in a deity. Einstein's Spinoza God as an example. Rejection of religion, indoctrination, God of the Bible, but was a deist in terms of there seems to be an intelligent being out there responsible for what we see/experience.
You know, I believe that wholeheartedly. Just like I believe you don't see how you continue the same in the response to another poster above. Yet another demerit for this whole business?
Spinoza was an atheist who had his work published posthumously...for reasons. No, I don't find that a spinozan philosophy makes me think a god does or might exist, and it's pretty clear spinoza didn't either.
Demerit? For prompting an honest question?
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 2:34 pm
The business of gods.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Let's be honest
May 12, 2023 at 3:28 pm
(May 12, 2023 at 1:56 pm)Kingpin Wrote: an agnostic/atheist boils down to moral arguments/judgments against God, I wouldn't call these arguments.
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