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The enormity of WWII
#51
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 12:43 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: no they were not.  samurai were a hereditary nobility abolished during Meiji revolution.    most of the more fanatical Japanese army officer class were from lower to middle class families and not descendants of hereditary samurai families.

Mere details. ‘Samurai is as samurai does.’ - Forrest Gump-San

Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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#52
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 12:19 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(August 10, 2023 at 9:05 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: My take would be they were wannabee samurai with the suicidal ideations that implies.

They managed to get the Japanese constitution revised (in the 1930s) with what seemed to be a very sensible codicil. "The Army and Navy representatives to the Imperial Cabinet will be active duty officers."

The catch is the two organizations could send their man to a different job if they wanted to. That would bring the current cabinet down. So any cabinet was hostage to the approval of the Army and/or Navy.

'wannabee' nothing. They WERE samurai.

Boru
No they were not as they were not nobility
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

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 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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#53
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 12:57 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(August 10, 2023 at 12:43 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: no they were not.  samurai were a hereditary nobility abolished during Meiji revolution.    most of the more fanatical Japanese army officer class were from lower to middle class families and not descendants of hereditary samurai families.

Mere details. ‘Samurai is as samurai does.’ - Forrest Gump-San

Boru
Samurai were a specific group with a specific historical and social context not just anyone could call themselves one.And it gets even sadder when one considers neither Kamikaze nor the Banzai charges were part of the Bushido code in fact it very much contradicts it as it would be viewed as a waste of valuable men and equipment.Those poor men were dying for a belief system that didn't say they needed to die.
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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#54
RE: The enormity of WWII
nobility is usually distinguished by its members’ firm rejection of the “nobility ie as nobility does” theory.
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#55
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 2:35 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: nobility is usually distinguished by its members’ firm rejection of the “nobility ie as nobility does” theory.

Faux nobility (Custer):  "In the name of General Sheridan I demand the unconditional surrender of this army!"

Nobility (Longstreet): "General Custer, I am not the commander of the army.  You are within the lines of your enemy without authority, addressing a superior officer, and in disrespect to General Grant as well as myself. If I was the commander of the army I would not receive the message of General Sheridan."
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#56
RE: The enormity of WWII
The Japanese fighting soldier and sailor was as fierce as they come. There is no nobility in war.

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#57
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: The Japanese fighting soldier and sailor was as fierce as they come. There is no nobility in war.

The fun thing about the 20th C. "samurai" was that they never defeated China, even when it was fighting them AND a civil war. Definitely not bushido material.

Yamamoto Isoruku was adopted into a samurai family to give the line some much needed new blood.
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#58
RE: The enormity of WWII
Quote:The fun thing about the 20th C. "samurai" was that they never defeated China, even when it was fighting them AND a civil war. Definitely not bushido material.
To my knowledge the Samurai never defeated China
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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#59
RE: The enormity of WWII
(August 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: The Japanese fighting soldier and sailor was as fierce as they come. There is no nobility in war.
This is true but it is tragic that all that spirit was wasted
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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#60
RE: The enormity of WWII
I hear the hoomans are working on a sequel. It's apparently a trilogy.
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