Hello soulcalm17

[Silver]

For gods, you just don't know yet the cause.

'Course we do. Human imagination.

[The Grand Nudger]

We know all sorts of things our new friend doesn't.

[Silver]

I know lots of things, but there is no ledge of reality upon which these concepts can rest.

[Sheldon]

because it is a prime cause/fundamental stuff. That ending of cause, is only logically and rationally have qualities of living and intelligent, thus it has a will and plan. If otherwise, then we belief in magic. 

I count three unevidenced assumptions, and the false dichotomy at the end is simply hilarious sorry, unless you can explain how this intelligent cause created anything, this claim has no explanatory powers whatsoever, thus you're the one positing magic.

I would prefer believe in unseen entity that have those qualities rather than believe in unknown magic that has no rational explanation.

That is a false dichotomy fallacy, and thus it is irrational by definition, so peppering your claims with the words rational and logical is pretty ironic, and of course believing that something was achieved using powers you can neither explain or evidence in any way, is the very definition of believing in magic. So again the irony is palpable.

[Mister Agenda]

Double Post

[Mister Agenda]

Changes in form/qualities is a sign of anything that have beginning. For virtual particles: you just don't know yet the cause. For hot dense state of big bang: you just don't know yet where did it came from. Of course it is impossible to see the beginning of universe, while we're stuck in present time. 

Now, these chain of cause, certainly has to be end. And we didn't ask anymore where did it come from, because it is a prime cause/fundamental stuff. That ending of cause, is only logically and rationally have qualities of living and intelligent, thus it has a will and plan. If otherwise, then we belief in magic. I would prefer believe in unseen entity that have those qualities rather than believe in unknown magic that has no rational explanation.

That the chain of causality has to end is an assertion supported by no evidence. Our intution doesn't like an endless chain of causality, but reality is under no obligation to conform to our intuition and has often demonstrated that it doesn't. God doesn't negate the problem: If a God caused everything and yet had no beginning, having existed for eternity in the past, it would have had an infinited expanse of time to pass through before starting the universe. If it did anything it had an infinity of things to do and if it did nothing it had an infinity of time to do nothing in before creating the universe.

And you have to show that if the universe had a cause, it wasn't a natural event. And calling such a natural event magic doesn't make it magic. It takes more than something not being understood to make it magic.

And believing something because you would prefer it to be true isn't rational. There are many things I would prefer to be true that just aren't, because reality doesn't care what we prefer.

[The Grand Nudger]

Soul won't be tightening up these arguments no matter what anyone says, and would not change his beliefs based upon any one or all of these arguments being demonstrably invalid or the assertions provably untrue..in the first place.

We see above, for example...that after all that time spent trying to convince us a book was magic and that on this basis belief in gods was rational, Soul actually thinks and speaks disparagingly of magic - as a thing which we should not believe or which should make a contention less credible..not more. Even if we presume that soul is just simple..and by "magic" really only means what we cannot explain - we should not be surprised when he fails to explain how goddidit.

Because soul does not believe on the basis of such arguments and does not find them compelling in the least. They're just things, scripts, strings of words, to be picked up and thrown away on convenience.

[Paleophyte]

Changes in form/qualities is a sign of anything that have beginning.

Untrue. The set of integers is infinite, unbound and unending, yet you can count from one to the next with little difficulty.

For virtual particles: you just don't know yet the cause.

And you don't know that they are caused. The fatal flaw in the statement that "Everything has a cause." is that nobody has checked everything to see if that is true.

Of course it is impossible to see the beginning of universe, while we're stuck in present time.

Or it's possible that the universe is eternal and that the Big Bang is simply the furthest back that we can see with current technology.

[Paleophyte]

Edited to remove duplicate post. Seriously internet, WTF?!? I only pressed that button once.

[Sheldon]

Magic
noun
1. the power of apparently influencing events by using mysterious or supernatural forces.

Do we really need to poll the atheists here, to see if a single one believes this is even possible, never mind that it must explain the origins of the universe? So we can add a straw man fallacy to @soulcalm17 list of irrational arguments.

I'd also insist now that he explains in detail with supporting objective evidence:

1. How is a deity possible?
2. How did a deity create the universe?

If he can't do this, then he is the one positing magic.