Veganism

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

^Every man a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts.’ - Bernard Baruch

As an aside, I once made a fretboard out of desert ironwood. Looked amazing, played even better.

Boru

[Thumpalumpacus]

As an aside, I once made a fretboard out of desert ironwood. Looked amazing, played even better.

Boru

Man, I bet that was pretty.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

As an aside, I once made a fretboard out of desert ironwood. Looked amazing, played even better.

Boru

Man, I bet that was pretty.

So pretty, I almost hated to sell it. Almost.

Boru

[Paleophyte]

If people don't consider something moral, then how can it be? Are you suggesting that there's some sort of external moral truth? Seems dodgy.

Do you find the mere possibility of morality being something independent of opinion dodgy?

To answer your questions: I'm suggesting that moral truths external to people's opinions is possible.

All of the evidence suggests otherwise.

[Disagreeable]

Do you find the mere possibility of morality being something independent of opinion dodgy?

To answer your questions: I'm suggesting that moral truths external to people's opinions is possible.

All of the evidence suggests otherwise.

And what evidence is that? Whether moral realism is true or false is greatly disputed in philosophy.

Rosewood and maple are both used as guitar fingerboards; that is a fact. I prefer rosewood, myself. That is an opinion.

I can base an opinion on facts. It is still an opinion.

I already pointed out that we can have opinions based on facts.

People can have moral opinions. But the question is still whether there are moral facts.

People can have scientific opinions. That doesn't stop there from being scientific facts.

[Thumpalumpacus]

People can have moral opinions. But the question is still whether there are moral facts.

Can you point to any "moral facts"?

[The Grand Nudger]

You were considering ecological facts which seemed like moral facts earlier. The way we do things has consequences, those consequences could be good or bad.

[Disagreeable]

People can have moral opinions. But the question is still whether there are moral facts.

Can you point to any "moral facts"?

Well for me personally I think that the fact that engaging in some actions or following some rules tend to increase suffering and engaging in some actions or following some rules tend to decrease suffering are examples of moral facts.

But there are other theories. Some philosophers think that moral facts are non-natural abstract facts that we can know through intuition. There is a philosopher, Michael Huemer, for example, who has said that if moral realism isn't true then if nobody thought that recreational baby torture was wrong then it wouldn't be wrong but it would clearly be wrong no matter what anybody thinks, so that's one example of a moral fact, therefore moral realism is true.

Personally I don't think that non-naturalism is plausible. And I don't think that intuition is enough to know that moral facts exist. I think that we can know what's good and bad phenomenologically through our experiences of happiness or suffering, and then we can know that encouraging actions that decrease overall suffering is moral and encouraging actions that increase overall suffering is immoral, for example.

[awty]

Facts can be proven. Morals and morality vary among people and societies.

Moral facts is not a thing.

[The Grand Nudger]

Women voting is bad because it destroys society. Provably true or provably false?