Scientific knowledge versus spiritual knowledge

[popsthebuilder]

What religions claim that? I am not aware of any, so perhaps you can inform me which ones make this claim. I understand the poetic exaggeration so I'm not taking it literally. Which religion claimed people can't be empathetic, loving to one another, good to their parents, respecting to one another, have good manners etc, without religious guidance?

Again, you need to learn the difference between what religion claims, and what it actually produces in reality. The kind motifs religions like to claim, in reality can be done without religion. The empathy as religion sells is not set up to be universal, although it does claim that. The empathy religion sets up in reality is tribal and at best "separate but equal" or is fine with others being a pet our house guest. That is empathy for the tribe, not empathy for all of humanity. The love for outsiders as depicted back then is conditional.

The God/s of Abraham are tribal characters because back when all three of those books were written, humans lived in feudal times and back then the mortality rate was much higher and it was extremely important for your own survival to tow the tribal line. So the love of others back then was for the tribe, those three holy books describe very violent revenge to anyone attacking the tribe. The obeying your parents were not because you were seen as an individual, you obeyed your parents because you were their property. 

Those books put you down even before you are born, teach you to assume the worst and only the sky boss can save you from the game he didn't have to set up. He blames you for the conditions he didnt have to put in place. Those books teach you to kill for the tribe. No, that is not the way the religious in the civil west like to view it, but again, those books were not written with our modern values in mind.

Religious people don't claim those things no, but they are totally unaware of how their false perceptions lead to bad actions. "Sin" is the concept that you are a piece of shit and are doomed to fail even before you do anything wrong. 

Robvalue is right. Religion convinces people they are nothing without it. The truth is if you have to live under promise of reward or threat of punishment, that is a very childlike and ignorant form of regulation. It is immoral to treat an adult as if they need a sky parent. As immoral as Kim Jong Un who will treat you well if you obey and "respect him". Doing the right thing is doing it even when nobody is watching and you don't get rewarded.

If someone needs bribes or threats to self regulate, by all means do it. But to expect others who do the same and do so without threats or bribes is vile. I am an adult and I don't need a sky parent watching me every second of my life or bullying me with threats of hell to do the right thing. And I don't need someone to dangle a cookie in front of me either.

Following what is right within your existence is beneficial to All existence, unless you seek reward.

Any, truly faithful to the One Creator GOD will not act out of greed, as they despise it.

Different times indeed called for different law. And if the law was wholly interpreted and documented without fault then there would have never been a need for the New covenant. Even that though, was intentionally misinterpreted by those who raised to power by force at that time(wholly against the truth of scriptures).

The next testament, or rather universal understanding of the will of GOD without the twisted manipulations of greedy, power hungry man secretly rooted in sin, is indeed needed. And will come. Atheist are not excluded, but rather needed in a way I think. They can grasp universal altruism more readily than most religious. They can also, through honest introspection, begin to grasp the concept of not only the conscience based around what you want, but the selfless conscience. These things, over time with perseverance, I think, will help many. Stepping out of the cycle that society(man) has made for us is also key.

I think many atheist easily have the potential to grasp and attain such things, and as such, perhaps learn of other things for the sake of profitable existence for all(and by profitable I mean like well-being, not money, or greed in any way)

Sorry may be ranting.

Peace

2¢

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.