Religion doesn't need evidence

[Joods]

Why do you keep saying "noble motives"? Why do you keep generalising people?

Most people come to religion through indoctrination, then stay because of fear. That's hardly noble.

I met alot of people who practice religion not so much out of fear but because they believe they are becoming more caring because of it and less egotistical. And because of such perfect improvement they believe that there is a God.

If people believe they need religion to be more caring, they lack empathy, that is all.

[Soldat Du Christ]

They shouldn't. At the end of the day, is the law maker responsable for what happens to the law breaker?

Say what?

Religous people (generaly speaking) fall behind in education because that's not required of them. Different prioreties. Now if i'm speaking just for christianity, it's Love god, and love your neighbor. You can go about these differant ways, i do not have a kind heart, a result of my nurturing i suppose. Hoever i am capable of wisdom. In that area i can serve god and help others in understanding.

I rather doubt your assertion that in general religious people are less motivated to educate themselves than non-religious people are. This is the type of theologically motivated assertion which most likely was pulled straight from your ass.

That's all you got? Do you just respond for the sake of it, or do you realy think you are making good points?

[Angrboda]

Say what?


I rather doubt your assertion that in general religious people are less motivated to educate themselves than non-religious people are.  This is the type of theologically motivated assertion which most likely was pulled straight from your ass.

That's all you got? Do you just respond for the sake of it, or do you realy think you are making good points?

Haha. "I know you are but what am I?" Seriously, that's your level of discourse? Pathetic.

[TheMonster]

Religion survives with all its corruption only because its postures itself as a guide on how to become less greedy and lustful and become a more compassionate person. Its the core. If you think that your living a noble/right/caring life, then what religious doctrine is behind it and especially scientific evidence dont matter at all. Because your living a "perfect life".

In conclusion, blind faith is supported in average sane religious person by noble motives, which legitimize the whole doctrine. And I agree with sane believers, compassion is really painful to accept and "sin" is what keeps me going.

Religion as an institution is corrupt like all our other institutions such as government, police, schools, military etc. Your reasons given for belonging to religions could probably be included on the list of reasons people join religions. I think that mostly they are dissatisfied with the other options available to make sense out of life. They're looking for what's missing in their lives and religion fills that empty space.

For me the universe just being here for no reason leaves me empty and leads me to to believe it's all part of something bigger with a definite purpose. Is material existence infinite? If so it shares a supernatural characteristic with God. Is it not infinite? What is out there beyond it? The main reason why I remain follower of Christ, though is that God's Spirit is in me. I can't deny what I experience. Someone telling me that God doesn't exist falls flat when I experience him daily. After I had a mountain biking accident in which I flew a good distance and broke six bones, I was still dealing with much pain after a couple years. I began a daily program of static stretching , which has relieved most of the pain. Recently, I've been reading articles stating that static stretching doesn't really help. In fact, some recommend not even doing it. I'm not going to discontinue my stretching routine because, no matter what they say, duh, I know it helps. So I attend a religious institution where I can worship God and interact with other believers.
[/quote]

Yes of course, it is true in some sense.
Christians have such a false persecution complex in the west. This makes no sense as they are the majority and symbols and references to Christianity is everywhere. You are constantly reminded that this is a Christian country and that its values should be our laws.... cleverly masqueraded as "social conservatism"... an excuse to impose one's convoluted sense of morals based on theology onto others. 

Atheists are indeed inconvenienced in this country and that is a fact. You have to believe in a God to become an elected official in some states (even though this is a blatant violation of the US constitution) . Prayer in schools, prayer in places of work... doesn't bother me but sure as hell weird and unwanted in a public institution run on tax dollars. Atheists are less trusted than rapists and pedophiles... so obviously being open about one's atheist views is detrimental as a whole. Discrimination is common and complaints are dismissed without much investigation. There are more atheists than Jews in America, but do we have a special interest group? Do politicians say anything good about us or at least pretend to represent our interests? No... what does that tell you?

So yes, it is nice for once to have a community where our views can be discussed without being judged by society. Validation of this nature is hard to come by in America, which is taken for granted by Christian folk.

Hmm. While i don't disagree that belief in a "God" is the standard of america, i'd hardly say it's Jesus that people look up too. The biblical Jesus anyway, not the strawman jesus to make people feel like they are good people. And i think you guys have been playing the minority card for too long now, athiesm is more than accepted at least here in north Cal.

Also, evolution is taught in schools, that requires more faith to believe in since we've never observed New DNA information being introduced through genetic mutation or any other method. Should be taught in a private school

[Gawdzilla Sama]

You think "society" is sane? 

Yes, for the most part. But then sane is subjective. Do I like it all and think it's a utopia, no.

Sane is optional, not subjective. Telling yourself that you have an invisible buddy who will send you to Hell for masturbating is not sane.

[GUBU]

Why do you keep saying "noble motives"? Why do you keep generalising people?

Most people come to religion through indoctrination, then stay because of fear. That's hardly noble.

I met alot of people who practice religion not so much out of fear but because they believe they are becoming more caring because of it and less egotistical. And because of such perfect improvement they believe that there is a God.

Good people are good because they are good, nkt because of religion. You have to have that spark inside you from the start.

On the other hand it has been said that religion is one of the few things in this world that can make good people do bad things (and if you think about it it is obvious why).

[GUBU]

Religion survives with all its corruption only because its postures itself as a guide on how to become less greedy and lustful and become a more compassionate person. Its the core. If you think that your living a noble/right/caring life, then what religious doctrine is behind it and especially scientific evidence dont matter at all. Because your living a "perfect life".

In conclusion, blind faith is supported in average sane religious person by noble motives, which legitimize the whole doctrine. And I agree with sane believers, compassion is really painful to accept and "sin" is what keeps me going.

I bet they got the morality from war times. at first they were persecuted by romans then came the dark ages. but after the industrial revolution it lost all substance, because people become moral in their search for progress.

The "persecution" by Rome was largely a post hoc invention by the church, at the point where it had become Rome's state religion, for two reasons a) the 'would they die for a lie?" myth and, b) to give the church a justification for the, very real, persecution of pagans in the Empire.

Yes, christians were often killed and quite gruesomely, but it is only under Diocletian that it was state policy and that they were killed in higher than expected numbers. Pagan Rome was very tolerant of religious diversity as long as you performed the sacrifices to the state/emperor regularly (these were more akin to the modern oath of alleigance than declarations of religious worship).

[Edwardo Piet]

I'm told by ChadWooters that theists struggle with the argument from the problem of evil.

Too fucking right they should.

And "free will" is the most bullshitty bollocks nonsense cop-out ever.

[Edwardo Piet]

I met alot of people who practice religion not so much out of fear but because they believe they are becoming more caring because of it and less egotistical. And because of such perfect improvement they believe that there is a God.

If people believe they need religion to be more caring, they lack empathy, that is all.

Certainly for some theists like people like Drich that is the case.

For others it may be that they have empathy but they think it comes from religion when it doesn't. They worry without their faith in God they would be heartless. When in reality if they have a heart with God they have a heart without God. And maybe they'll not only have a heart on the inside without God, but maybe they'll also be better at expressing it on the outside if they're one of those theists that does care about people but has bigoted beliefs and a funny way of showing it because of their stupid fucking fundamentalist upbringing and indoctrination.

[brewer]

Yes, for the most part. But then sane is subjective. Do I like it all and think it's a utopia, no.

Sane is optional, not subjective. Telling yourself that you have an invisible buddy who will send you to Hell for masturbating is not sane.

Nope, sane is subjective. Thinking you have a magic buddy who takes care of you, little over the edge. Thinking that you can magically float a kitten to safety through freeway traffic, medium over the edge (heard this one 3 weeks ago). Harming people because of the computer chip implant placed in your head by CIA told you to, a lot over the edge. See, subjective. Are you being intentionally obtuse?