The guy who saw fit to opine upon the americans first response is now bothered by shallow and pedantic comments. I agree with you, of course, theres no "I need a gun because I live in the country" argument that I find compelling, that just doesn;t matter though, since that need isn't required in order for me (or any american) to justify gun ownership. You can argue against that "argument" all day long and it won;t matter. Understand?

Even if a coyote is in your yard, so what?  What is he going to do?  Break into your house?

This video of a mama bear and five cubs swimming in a backyard pool went viral here a little while ago.






Notice that none of them were armed or in possession of burglary tools.

It's good to see that they weren't in possession of a small childs limbs either.

(August 27, 2015 at 2:04 pm)Napoléon Wrote: It's an argument that can be made sure, I don't think it's a compelling one though when people are being massacred every year because of these few people's claim to need a gun to shoot coyotes or because they might come across a bear.

The thing is, you can tie the legal requirements for gun ownership to a demonstrated need for one. That's why the "everyone gets a gun because some people need a gun," logic fails. I believe that's how it works in Australia; you can procure a gun, but you need a demonstrable reason for owning one, and "I just want to have it around, looming over every moment because of a bizarre, ideologically motivated arms race my culture has been embroiled in for decades," is not a sufficient reason. You want it for hunting? Target shooting? Protection from wildlife? You got it. Want it to menace people or for no reason in particular? Nah.

There aren't any mass shootings in Aus, really, as a result. I feel like not having guns all over the place, saved for a rainy day or for weird, revolutionary revenge fantasies against a librul govermen' plays a big part in that. Not many people there even want a gun, as far as I know. There's not this desperate need to just have them. That's probably the big cultural change that needs to happen with America, disengaging guns from patriotism, turning them into less of a weird necessity, but honestly, I don't think "why do you need this deadly weapon?" is an unreasonable question to ask as a barrier of entry to gun ownership.

"Target shooting" the man replies, silently planning a homocide. I'm -all for- better legislation and stricter gun laws......but shouldn't the things we come up with actually....do something?

(August 27, 2015 at 4:01 pm)Esquilax Wrote: I don't think "why do you need this deadly weapon?" is an unreasonable question to ask as a barrier of entry to gun ownership.

The only problem I foresee is that circumstances can change. Say a guy can demonstrate he needs a gun for any particular reason one year, what happens in 2 years time when he moves to the city? Or what happens if he suddenly gets depressed and wants to shoot himself? Might sound daft but shit happens. I think asking the question is a good start but there needs to be far more than that to ensure that those very few who do need guns continually meet the requirements/conditions.

But I'm still not at all convinced of any reason someone would need a gun. I just don't see it. So you have coyotes that come onto your property? Is that good enough reason alone to own a gun? I honestly think most places outside of America would say no.

I doubt that many americans think so either.......but again, it just doesn't matter either way, in context.

(August 27, 2015 at 4:18 pm)Napoléon Wrote:

(August 27, 2015 at 4:01 pm)Esquilax Wrote: I don't think "why do you need this deadly weapon?" is an unreasonable question to ask as a barrier of entry to gun ownership.

The only problem I foresee is that circumstances can change. Say a guy can demonstrate he needs a gun for any particular reason one year, what happens in 2 years time when he moves to the city? Or what happens if he suddenly gets depressed and wants to shoot himself? Might sound daft but shit happens. I think asking the question is a good start but there needs to be far more than that to ensure that those very few who do need guns continually meet the requirements/conditions.

But I'm still not at all convinced of any reason someone would need a gun. I just don't see it. So you have coyotes that come onto your property? Is that good enough reason alone to own a gun? I honestly think most places outside of America would say no.

My bold.

Yeah, this is what I meant when I said we've all been there. I've had some pretty dark times; who knows what I would have been capable of in those moments had I owned a gun.

I think a good start on gun control would be to first attack the handgun angle. I don't see us ever being rid of rifles and shotguns, but maybe something happening with handguns could get the ball rolling in that direction.

You'd have been capable of whatever it was you were capable of -without- the gun.  Guns aren't magic, they don't change who you are or what you're prepared to do.  People don't say to themselves "well, normally I wouldn't shoot this street corner up/kill myself, but....since I have a gun........". In any case, stricter laws regarding handgun purchase, transport, and ownership would go a long way. Legislation aimed at handguns has a history of success. Some nutters worry, of course, that this will bleed over into other types of firearms, breech loading long rifles, for example. To some extent I can understand, given the average anti-gun nuts knowledge of firearms is mostly derived from fantasy, but in the end, I'm sure we could work something out - like we already have in many states, many counties, many cities. Even an outright -ban- on handguns wouldn;t be enough to breach the letter of the law,

"But my rights, I have a right!". Of course you do, and you have not only a right but a wide selection of breech/bolt action single shot rifles over x inches long. You're welcome.

(August 27, 2015 at 5:53 pm)Rhythm Wrote: You'd have been capable of whatever it was you were capable of -without- the gun

Except shooting a gun in anger or depression. It crossed my mind. These situations are why sayings like "cooler heads prevail" exist.