(October 11, 2015 at 1:31 pm)Randys brother Wrote: You know you pretend you don't see the evidence I presented earlier on.

Wrong. Liar.

I see it plain-as-day. It just doesn't say what you think it says, or what the incestuous though-circles (that comprise the fundamentalist apologetics factories you have decided are the only ones you're willing to listen to) say.

As I said, there's not much point in listening to you when you have admitted that your mind is closed.

(October 11, 2015 at 1:57 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 1:31 pm)Randys brother Wrote: You know you pretend you don't see the evidence I presented earlier on.

Wrong. Liar.

I see it plain-as-day. It just doesn't say what you think it says, or what the incestuous though-circles (that comprise the fundamentalist apologetics factories you have decided are the only ones you're willing to listen to) say.

As I said, there's not much point in listening to you when you have admitted  that your mind is closed.

  What do you expect rocketsurgeon they lie for christ they forge "evidence" for christ/god and refuse the reality that
christianity is based off of plagiarizing off of other religions.

(October 11, 2015 at 7:20 am)Randys brother Wrote: Let's break up the argument.

Oh boy...this should be good...

Quote:Now this is where you go wrong, God wants you to have a high morality and follow him. Simple wording.

Ok, Catholic boy...how much do you like your current pope? He says atheists can totally get into heaven on works alone, and his utterances are supposed to be inerrant messages from Gaud, right? That's your theology, isn't it? How good a Catholic are you?


I realize there is some debate as to what he actually meant, but if that's the case, why would that be? Wouldn't Gaud's infallible messenger be able to communicate effectively enough that there's no argument about what he means when he says things? Oh, who am I kidding? Of course not.

Quote:Your suggesting, why can’t one just be Good and go to heaven, As Paul explains in Philippians 2:13, "God is the one, who, for his good purpose, works in you both to desire and to work. “Notice that Paul's words presuppose that the faithful Christian is not just desiring to be righteous, but is actively working toward it. James 2:17 reminds us that "faith of itself, if it does not have work, is dead." In verse 24 James says, "See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone." And later: "For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead" (2:26).

Yes, and your stupid little book also says that "all who believe in their hearts and confess with their mouths will be saved." In context with everything else, this is often interpreted to mean that faith alone is the key to salvation, but if that faith does not produce works then it's obviously not real faith and Gaud will know and he'll JUUUUUDGE you. Maybe Catholics don't believe that, but plenty of Christians do.

Quote:No, human morality is corrupted by sin, but we are not to give up if we did then that’s sin, but if we did then we can trust on God’s mercy and by putting the effort of a confession.

No. Human morality is corrupted by religion. Check.

Quote:God is not limited to anything, he can do whatever he wants and you have no right to say what he should be doing.

Good...then you admit that Gaud's morality and standards are subject to his whim, and morality is therefore subjective and not objective. We'll come back to that.

Quote:You, miss the point here that nobody’s good, we are saved by grace we have all sinned, like I said before we are without excuse since we sin too (Romans 3:23; 5:12), and we all deserve death before a perfect Holy God. To assume Adam’s descendants are innocent is a false assumption. Due to the sin nature received from Adam, death is coming for all since all have sinned (Romans 3:23).

A perfectly holy god who arbitrarily sets and changes his morals and standards, saves evil people just because of what they believed, condemns good people simply for a fully justified lack of belief, and is allegedly responsible for more death, destruction, and atrocity (at least on Earth) than any other being in the Universe? That shit is dripping with Paradox, yo.

Quote:Even if there good evidence one can simply ignore it or simply not look for it, it does make sense to you because you do not have faith.

Ummm...what? Other people might be nice enough to fix your fucked up English, but seriously, learn the damn language if you're going to address me. Not being able to spell is one thing, but you're not even getting your basic thoughts across properly.

(October 11, 2015 at 1:23 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 1:19 pm)drfuzzy Wrote: This idiot ignores anything that doesn't come out of the wholly babble, that monstrous book of sick moronic fairy tales he worships so slavishly.  He pulls a few things from fundamentalist sources sometimes, which are notorious for twisting facts to match their wholly babble.  Occasionally he will add something that he took from a Chick tract or twisted up in his head.   But he's essentially stayed on the same stupid message that we all have rejected for decades:  "believe ______  chapter and verse or you'll go to hell".   (yawn)    We tell him that his chapters and verses have less meaning to us than Stephenie Meyer's Twilight series, but he doesn't seem to be capable of understanding.  He probably thinks that his magic book verses will abracadabra us into believing if he just drops enough of 'em on us.    

Wait... so... you're saying you don't believe in vampires?

Ah - how dare you?  The nerve!  It's the SPARKLY vampires that aren't real, silly!  You see, the blasphemer Meyers took REAL vampires and turned them into sparkly safe things that only hunt animals.  (shudder)      The REAL vampires are shown clearly in the gospels by Anne Rice.

(October 11, 2015 at 6:29 am)Randys brother Wrote: Why does atheism exist?

• Atheism exist's because of people's pride.
  
• So that have obey God's rules.
  
• So that they don't have obey there Father and Mother.
  
• So that they can watch Porn.
  
• So that can show that there cool.
  

No, because people don't believe in deities.  My experience is that believe are FAR more arrogant and prideful than any atheist.
You mean the rules of men who claimed they were speaking on behalf of a deity.  But, in a way, you're right.  I don't want to obey biblical rules like stoning disobedient children, killing people who work on the Sabbath, keeping slaves, treating women as inferior, etc., etc.
I obey my parents for the most part.  But, I'm a grown, adult, independent woman (something against the rules of your little book of myths), and I make my own way in the world, obeying the rules of society.
Statistics show that the highest rates of watching porn online are in the more conservative religious areas of the world: the Middle East and the Bible belt.  Hmmmm, I guess it's the religious who watch the most porn.  The Vatican also has one of the largest collections of pornography in the world
I was cool when I was religious, too.  I guess it's just something I was born with.

(October 11, 2015 at 1:57 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 1:31 pm)Randys brother Wrote: You know you pretend you don't see the evidence I presented earlier on.

Wrong. Liar.

I see it plain-as-day. It just doesn't say what you think it says, or what the incestuous though-circles (that comprise the fundamentalist apologetics factories you have decided are the only ones you're willing to listen to) say.

As I said, there's not much point in listening to you when you have admitted  that your mind is closed.

Nope your lying, you pretend you don't see the evidence I presented earlier on.

same with you

To:I am not mafia

There you happy?

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(October 11, 2015 at 2:30 pm)Redbeard The Pink Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 7:20 am)Randys brother Wrote: Let's break up the argument.

Oh boy...this should be good...

Quote:Now this is where you go wrong, God wants you to have a high morality and follow him. Simple wording.

Ok, Catholic boy...how much do you like your current pope? He says atheists can totally get into heaven on works alone, and his utterances are supposed to be inerrant messages from Gaud, right? That's your theology, isn't it? How good a Catholic are you?


I realize there is some debate as to what he actually meant, but if that's the case, why would that be? Wouldn't Gaud's infallible messenger be able to communicate effectively enough that there's no argument about what he means when he says things? Oh, who am I kidding? Of course not.

Quote:Your suggesting, why can’t one just be Good and go to heaven, As Paul explains in Philippians 2:13, "God is the one, who, for his good purpose, works in you both to desire and to work. “Notice that Paul's words presuppose that the faithful Christian is not just desiring to be righteous, but is actively working toward it. James 2:17 reminds us that "faith of itself, if it does not have work, is dead." In verse 24 James says, "See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone." And later: "For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead" (2:26).

Yes, and your stupid little book also says that "all who believe in their hearts and confess with their mouths will be saved." In context with everything else, this is often interpreted to mean that faith alone is the key to salvation, but if that faith does not produce works then it's obviously not real faith and Gaud will know and he'll JUUUUUDGE you. Maybe Catholics don't believe that, but plenty of Christians do.

Quote:No, human morality is corrupted by sin, but we are not to give up if we did then that’s sin, but if we did then we can trust on God’s mercy and by putting the effort of a confession.

No. Human morality is corrupted by religion. Check.

Quote:God is not limited to anything, he can do whatever he wants and you have no right to say what he should be doing.

Good...then you admit that Gaud's morality and standards are subject to his whim, and morality is therefore subjective and not objective. We'll come back to that.

Quote:You, miss the point here that nobody’s good, we are saved by grace we have all sinned, like I said before we are without excuse since we sin too (Romans 3:23; 5:12), and we all deserve death before a perfect Holy God. To assume Adam’s descendants are innocent is a false assumption. Due to the sin nature received from Adam, death is coming for all since all have sinned (Romans 3:23).

A perfectly holy god who arbitrarily sets and changes his morals and standards, saves evil people just because of what they believed, condemns good people simply for a fully justified lack of belief, and is allegedly responsible for more death, destruction, and atrocity (at least on Earth) than any other being in the Universe? That shit is dripping with Paradox, yo.

Quote:Even if there good evidence one can simply ignore it or simply not look for it, it does make sense to you because you do not have faith.

Ummm...what? Other people might be nice enough to fix your fucked up English, but seriously, learn the damn language if you're going to address me. Not being able to spell is one thing, but you're not even getting your basic thoughts across properly.

Don't worry my friend,I'll catch you back.  
Just don't have time now.

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(October 11, 2015 at 2:38 pm)drfuzzy Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 1:23 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Wait... so... you're saying you don't believe in vampires?

Ah - how dare you?  The nerve!  It's the SPARKLY vampires that aren't real, silly!  You see, the blasphemer Meyers took REAL vampires and turned them into sparkly safe things that only hunt animals.  (shudder)      The REAL vampires are shown clearly in the gospels by Anne Rice.

You still haven't answered my question.

(October 11, 2015 at 11:15 am)Randys brother Wrote: I have to speak the truth

Quote:Quote Stimbo the Fool:Wrong. Don't you ever strawman me again.

Or what, you will ban me, I don’t care and I will even call you a fool for not believing.

Quote:again by Stimbo the Fool:But what it does mean is that if we as Staff decide that you are in breach of the Rules, you will accept the decision.

Quote:By Stimbo the Fool:Yes and especially yes, respectively. The pope doesn't even have an excuse, because it's his job. Either he truly believes in fairytale nonsense, making him an idiot, or he doesn't and he's getting paid for a job he knows is a lie.

You, fool still looking to find fault with anything Godly and your lack of faith.

And I'll call you a fuckwit for believing in fairytales.

*responds to troll just for fun*

@ Randy's Brother : Hey Catholic dude Why do you believe the bullshit you believe in? Just for fun and for my own entertainment I feel like a debate with you. A serious debate? Yeah but I'll try to make it fun if I can... for myself! You may find my reasons to debate you to be non-serious, and they are... but the debate itself will mostly be serious....mostly. I would appreciate it if you respond to this so I can piss myself laughing.

All the best,

Evie the Turtle.

(October 11, 2015 at 11:17 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote: I see the dumbass chose death by Stimbo. Best decision of his sad, pathetic, little life...

Yeah, he's trying really hard. what would one expect huh?

(October 11, 2015 at 2:41 pm)Beccs Wrote:

(October 11, 2015 at 6:29 am)Randys brother Wrote: Why does atheism exist?

• Atheism exist's because of people's pride.
  
• So that have obey God's rules.
  
• So that they don't have obey there Father and Mother.
  
• So that they can watch Porn.
  
• So that can show that there cool.
  

No, because people don't believe in deities.  My experience is that believe are FAR more arrogant and prideful than any atheist.
You mean the rules of men who claimed they were speaking on behalf of a deity.  But, in a way, you're right.  I don't want to obey biblical rules like stoning disobedient children, killing people who work on the Sabbath, keeping slaves, treating women as inferior, etc., etc.
I obey my parents for the most part.  But, I'm a grown, adult, independent woman (something against the rules of your little book of myths), and I make my own way in the world, obeying the rules of society.
Statistics show that the highest rates of watching porn online are in the more conservative religious areas of the world: the Middle East and the Bible belt.  Hmmmm, I guess it's the religious who watch the most porn.  The Vatican also has one of the largest collections of pornography in the world
I was cool when I was religious, too.  I guess it's just something I was born with.

You mean the Vatican's art gallery?or other

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As a Catholic.. 


Media trying REALLY hard to create controversy and misreport things. 
The headline is misleading. Several Dioceses having 50% shares does not mean that "The Catholic Church" is selling porn. 

Many don't realize that for a few years in the 70s.. the I.R.S. seized possession of the Mustang Ranch whore house in NV and owned it for a short time. 
That doesn't mean that the U.S. government was into prostitution. 

Secondly, just because it is worth billions or has billions in revenue, does not mean that those dioceses are getting ALL of that or even 50%. The article makes it seem like the Dioceses gets billions from this 1 single investment. 
I don't know of ANY dioceses that has an operating budget that high. I think one of the highest operating budgets is around 300million and that's the Dioceses of Chicago.. if I'm not mistaken. 


So be careful how the media 'spins' things to sell papers. 

_________________________________ 

But having said that... 


However, the Church SHOULD sell its shares if the company will not change. 
Even if that means less money to charities.. they have to separate themselves from the porn industry. 

It does look bad that things were reported 10 years ago.. however, outside people have to realize something.... 

1) The Church may have allocated those funds to certain charities.. so it at the very least complicates things to simply shares their stock and not be able to fund those charities. 

2) The Catholic church is notorious for moving VERY slowly. The sexual abuse controversy was created in part by the church taking decades to decide things. This is no different. Sometimes the church has pondered a philosophical or moral issue for centuries. So a decade.. though it looks bad.. is not uncommon. 
Still, I think they should react faster. But non-Catholics seem to expect the church to react like a nibble corporation, which it isn't. Due-process takes its due time. 

3) The article says that the Dioceses holds stock...but it is unclear HOW those stock options were bought. Perhaps there is a legal reason why it can not. Perhaps it takes a certain vote. Perhaps the dioceses wants to.. and a key person within the dioceses is preventing them because of his or her vote. The article doesn't provide us NEARLY enough detail. It stops short of actually getting the Dioceses answer or reasons. - So we simply don't have all the details 

4) We don't know if the initial allegation was reported to the right person or if it is moving through some sorta process. The article seems to assume that the allegation was reported correctly and that absolutely NOTHING is currently being done, simply because the church still owns the shares. 

5) Even if the Vatican received money from this dioceses.. it isn't enough to prove that the Church as a whole knew about this. We have to be careful to jump to unsupported conclusions based on our own opinions of the Catholic church. Doing so would be both biased and unjust. 


______________________ 

Finally.. YES there is a chance that this constitutes a legit controversy and greed on the behalf of those dioceses. 
So yes, as more details come out.. it could be very bad. But we don't know at this point, so we should withhold speculation. 


I'm actually GLAD that the article illuminated this for us fellow Catholics. And I certainly hope this embarrasses that dioceses enough to get them to step things up and take the correct action which would be to sell their shares.

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The church is against porn

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The Catechism defines pornography as “removing real or simulated sexual acts from the intimacy of the partners, in order to display them deliberately to third parties” (#2337).  Sadly, pornography is a pervasive, multi-billion dollar business in our country alone, with revenues generated from movies, cable and dish network television, magazines, books, and other materials.  U.S. News & World Reportclaimed that the pornography industry grossed roughly $8 billion in 1997.  Just one example of the extent of this industry is that in 2001, 630 million “adult” videos were rented in the United States.
Moreover, the internet is the cheapest, fastest, and most anonymous pornography source.  Internet pornographers made over $1 billion in revenues dealing their merchandise on-line.  The threat of pornography over the internet cannot be discounted:  70% of children viewing pornography on the internet do so in public schools and libraries (The Internet Online Summit, 1997).  All of us realize that we are surrounded by various forms pornography, whether noticing the “adult” section of videos at Blockbuster, surfing the internet, seeing advertising which is clearly sexually suggestive, or innocently going to a movie that just happens to have some kind of sex scene.
The Catechism gives three reasons why pornography is wrong and sinful:  First, pornography offends against the virtue of chastity.  Called to lead a chaste life, each Christian must respect the sanctity of his own human sexuality, which involves the integration of his physical and spiritual being.  He must also respect the holy state of marriage:  Our Lord taught in reply to the Pharisees’ question about divorce: “Have you not read that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female, and declared, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife, and the two shall become as one’?  Thus they are no longer two but one flesh” (Matthew 19:4-6).   Therefore,  the conjugal love which reflects the sacramental union of husband and wife, and the enactment of their vows is also sacred: the conjugal act ought to express that faithful, permanent, exclusive, self-giving, and life-giving love between husband and wife.
However, the respect for marriage and its conjugal love is not simply limited to any physical expression.  The respect also includes the spiritual dimension: Jesus taught, “You have heard it said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.  But I say to you, everyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery in his heart” (Matthew 5:27-28).  Therefore, chastity “involves the integrity of the person and the integrality of the gift”(#2337).  On the other hand, pornography is an act of spiritual adultery, which leads to the spiritual disintegration of the person and may lead to physical adultery or other illicit sexual acts.
Second, pornography offends the dignity of the participants (actors, vendors, the public).  Each one is exploited himself or exploits others in some way for personal pleasure or gain.  In all, the dignity of the human being–  whether the person posing, the person producing, the person distributing, or the person enjoying– is debased.
Finally, those who engage in pornography immerse themselves in a fantasy world, withdrawing from reality.  While genuine love always involves a self-giving of oneself for the good of others, pornography entices a person to withdraw into a selfish world of perverted fantasy which may later be acted out to the detriment of oneself and others.  This problem has increased dramatically, since the internet offers “virtual reality” sexual interaction.
The sinfulness of pornography, however, is not simply linked to a “one time, one action” phenomenon, but may become like a spiritual cancer that corrupts the person.  Dr. Victor Cline (1996) posited four progressive effects of pornography:  (1) addiction, where the need to view pornographic materials leads to a loss of free control over behavior; (2) escalation, where the person delves into progressively harder pornography, usually to attain the same level of sensation and arousal; (3) desensitization, whereby the user is no longer morally sensitive to the shocking, illegal, repulsive, perverted, or immoral quality of the material, but instead views it as acceptable and begins to look upon others as objects; and (4) acting out, where the fantasizing becomes overt behavior.
Without question, pornography has a devastating impact upon all of society, especially women and young children.  Pornography teaches that women enjoy “forced” or perverse sexual activity; advocates prostitution, exhibitionism, and voyeurism as normal behavior; and regards women as sex objects to be used for one’s self-gratification.  For some men, the regular use of pornography normalizes aggression towards women in sexual and other interpersonal encounters, and increases the tolerance for such aggression against women in the larger culture (Surrette, 1992).  Sadly, the greatest impact may be on the young, especially males 12 through 17 years of age, because pornography portrays sexual activity outside of marriage as acceptable without the dire consequences of AIDS or other venereal diseases, and without the responsibility towards conceiving a human life.
These assertions are supported by criminal evidence:  A proven direct correlation exists between crimes of rape, child abuse, and the physical abuse of a spouse, and the proliferation of pornographic materials and the presence of live porn and sexually oriented businesses in a community (Uniform Crime Report, 1990).  Several examples support the correlation:  In 1991, the Los Angeles Police Department found in a period of ten years that pornography was involved in two-thirds of all child molestation cases.  One out of every six persons in our federal and state prisons is a sex offender, and sex crimes are second only to drug crimes.  Finally, in 1988, the Federal Bureau of Investigation reported that 81% of violent sexual offenders regularly read or viewed violent pornography.
As Christians we must be on guard against pornography, not only avoiding any use, but also rejecting any image or thought which may arise accidently, such as when we innocently go to a movie.  We must be very prudent in selecting what we view and even to what we listen.   Moreover, in our prayers, we must pray for the virtue of chastity, begging the Lord for the grace to be chaste and to respect the dignity of all individuals, especially those members of the opposite sex.  If we should fail, and we purposely participate in some form of pornography or accept some form of pornographic imagery or thoughts which may not have been deliberately sought after but nevertheless accepted, we need to repent, go to confession, and receive absolution.  The Catechism teaches that pornography “is a grave offense,” meaning objectively in the area of mortal sin.  Never do we want to make light of this sin and allow it to take root in our lives.
Just as a side note:  For those who have severe problems in breaking a habit of engaging in pornography or for those who are addicted, Sexaholics Anonymous is a solid organization which helps individuals break their addiction and lead a chaste life.  Members battle an obsession about sex– sex with self, promiscuity, pornography, adultery, unhealthy relationships, and erotic fantasy.  Like most self-help programs, Sexaholics Anonymous involves a twelve-step program.Source:http://catholicstraightanswers.com/what-does-the-church-regarding-pornography/

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