My favourite quote from Garak was over the story of the boy who cried wolf.

He said it was a horrible story.

Was then told that the moral of the story is to not lie.

"Are you sure that's the moral?"

"Of course. What else could it be?"

"Never tell the same lie twice..."

Yeah, Garack was definitely not the typical Star Trek "hero". You couldn't get stuff like that or Quark and his "root beer" speech on any other Trek series.

One of the things that really annoyed me about TNG was the length the Federation seemed to be willing to go through to avoid conflict.

You got the impression that if an unknown alien species wiped out a colony of 50,000 people the response would be, "Let's chase them down so we can talk to them and find out ways to avoid misunderstandings!"

DS9 and, to a lesser extent, Voyager somewhat reversed it.

Though it seems weird that Sisko was recognised as the man who started the Dominion War, even when the Dominion had been attacking Federation and Klingon ships on the Alpha Quadrant LONG before the war actually started.

For anyone who's interested, I recommend looking up Star Trek renegades - it's a fan series being made. Actors? Walter Koenig (Chekov), Tim Russ (Tuvoc), Terry Farrell (Jadzia (not sure how they're working that one in), Aron Eisenberg (Nog), and Robert Baltran (Chakotay), among others...

Yes, I'm a serious Trek geek. (40,000 posts at ST.com should give some idea...)

(November 11, 2015 at 11:21 pm)Beccs Wrote: One of the things that really annoyed me about TNG was the length the Federation seemed to be willing to go through to avoid conflict.

Hence the Bajoran situation and the Marquis. Both originated in TNG though so they did address the Federation's "peace at all costs" policy and the resultant consequences of it.

People seem to either hate on DS9 or Voyager.

DS9 was brilliant, especially with that Dominion war. As well, the greatest Star Trek character is Gul Dukat. By Kahless is that man awesome.

Voyager, while maybe inconsistent and yeah, the conflicts settled early and everyone assimilated into a Starfleet member, I still liked the show. It had interesting episodes.

Enterprise was the weakest of the live action Treks, but it had good episodes and good moments. I liked the 911 season and the beginnings to the Romulan war and the alien Nazi allies episodes, even the one with the Borg.

TNG was great but there were too many speeches and there wasn't enough fighting.

TOS had that nice cheesy 60's feel but some absolutely amazing episodes. Remember that episode with the giant space amoeba, or the one with the Romulan and their new weapon? Or how about City On The Edge Of Forever? That one was brilliant!

Don't watch Star Trek the Animated Series, unless you're a super geek. It's terrible. I've seen them all, there's not much to offer.

As for the movies, aside from 3, all odd number Star Trek films suck, and only First Contact is entertaining as far as the TNG movies go. I also don't like the direction the new Trek films took. I don't care that it's an alternative time line, but they turned it into an action flick rather than a drama. I don't like that at all.

The only Star Trek series in which I invested any time was Voyager. I quite liked that one. Otherwise, Star Trek never really held my interest.

(November 11, 2015 at 6:58 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: I'm surprised so many seem to not like DS9.  It's different, to be sure, but I thought it was wonderful.  Sisko is a pretty complex character, and the actor chews scenery with the best of them.  I mean, Picard wouldn't do this:





Plus, it had the Defiant, my favorite ship, and Garak, one of the most brilliant characters Trek has ever had.

Voyager sucked.  Badly.  The entire series should've been the Year of Hell two-parter.  Dwindling resources, a ship slowly losing the battle of attrition, people dying and not being replaced.  Instead, it was TNG-lite.  They ruined Q, ruined the Borg, the Species 8-blahblahblah guys were boring, the Kazon were boring.  The writing was so uneven and self-contradictory between episodes that Kate Mulgrew has said that she played Janeway as though she was bipolar.  Garret Wang was a useless waste of space that they were going to kill off because he sucked, but then he was named one of People's most beautiful people, so they killed off Kes instead.  And, somehow, Neelix lived the entire time.

Enterprise was terrible until the 4th season when Berman and Braga turned the reigns over to Manny Coto.  Suddenly, he's trying to fix the Vulcans being assholes for no good reason, introducing the Romulans, and basically fulfilling the promise that, hey, this actually is the show that highlights how the Federation came together.  His fixes didn't all work (Archer being a proxy for Vulcan Jesus was odd to say the least, for example), but at least he recognized the problems.  And then B&B had to fuck it all up with that abortion of a finale that made the entirety of Enterprise less important to the franchise than an unremarkable late season episode of TNG.  Good job, guys.

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Regarding the upcoming series, I'm not very interested.  The reboot movies, while fun with their bombastic exuberance, are pretty dumb.  Add in the fact that, outside of the pilot, all episodes will be on CBS's paid streaming service, and I can't really get myself to care.  I foresee Apple Store interiors, lots of beautiful people, and steamy sexual encounters.

Agree, DS9 does not get the credit it deserves.

The main problem I had was I just hated Kira.  Sorry B'joran fans.

But Garak, Quark, Dax, sisko, these were great characters with fantastically complex story lines!  

Voyager wasn't total shit either.  I loved the doctor, and Janeway....and that's about it, lol.  I thought the episode where the one Q wanted to commit suicide was great.  It had it's moments, but...meh.  It was still better than Enterprise.

(November 11, 2015 at 11:21 pm)Beccs Wrote: For anyone who's interested, I recommend looking up Star Trek renegades - it's a fan series being made.  

I just watched ST: Renegades, earlier tonight. Too bad there's just the one, 90-minute pilot. You can tell it's low-budget, but it's really well made. If a studio backed that, it could really be something!

The 140+ year old Admiral Chekov as head of the Starfleet Intelligence Service is most definitely an interesting development.

ETA: It kinda felt like Star Trek and Firefly had a kid together.

You guys all claim to be Trekkie geeks and fanbois. Pftpftpftpftpft

I named my kid Jadzia! That is a Trekkie geek!

Could never get into the "Next Generation" and got burned out on "Lost in Space" x "Gilligan's Island" er... I mean "Voyager" (though 7 of 9 kept me watching for an extra year).