(February 13, 2016 at 12:33 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote:

(February 13, 2016 at 11:32 am)Irrational Wrote: Come on, it's far easier to control one's words than it is to control one's weight ...

You can certainly say what you want, though. I just don't accept your view that overweight people are so because they generally choose to be so.

Except I never said that. You're putting words in my mouth. I made the distinction early on between fat people who are fat for reasons out of their control, and people who are fat because of their own faults, basically, and even consider that to be something they should pride themselves on. I specifically said I have no issue with the former, that would be irrational, but I will criticize the later.

Again, the problem is most people don't choose to become fat. Get it? It's not a choice! It's an aggregate combination of genetic and environmental factors that lead to weight problems and/or exacerbate them. So you can hardly say that this is their fault. Therefore, it would still be irrational of you to harshly criticize people for being of a certain weight.

Quote:This is typical of a regressive mindset. Your SJW complex makes you create problems where there aren't any to be had.

Your personal attacks against me don't make your argument any more true. Empirical evidence (i.e. science) goes against you. So regressive or not, this not just based on my personal mindset. This is based on facts.

Quote:Again, the problem is most people don't choose to become fat. Get it? It's not a choice! It's an aggregate combination of genetic and environmental factors that lead to weight problems and/or exacerbate them. So you can hardly say that this is their fault. Therefore, it would still be irrational of you to harshly criticize people for being of a certain weight.

Are you on drugs, or something? I only criticise those that obviously have a choice in the matter. The woman cited in the OP clearly had one. She went from one extreme too far over the other.

I never said anything about how many people have a choice in the matter, and I don't think you're qualified to make that claim either, not that it matters. If it can be shown that most people don't have a choice, then I won't criticize those people. Is this so hard for you to understand? Try reading what I'm saying slower - that might help perhaps.

Quote:Your personal attacks against me don't make your argument any more true. Empirical evidence (i.e. science) goes against you. So regressive or not, this not just based on my personal mindset. This is based on facts.

Hit me with some facts regarding your claims, then. But in principle, if those facts hold as true, that doesn't contradict what I'm saying in the least. Again, you're strawmanning me, and ironically enough, after I describe exactly what you're doing you're calling it an attack. What the fuck is wrong with you?

(February 13, 2016 at 12:32 pm)Losty Wrote:

(February 13, 2016 at 12:29 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote: Why can't it be about both? Why wouldn't I admit it's about attractiveness as well? I said as much up until now. But as I later added, I don't weight is what makes her unattractive to me, rather her apparently simplistic mind.

I think the objection with it being about both is that no one really believes any of you care about some random stranger's health. No one believes you really take moral objection to someone being of bad health either.  

So they want you to be honest and say "eww you're fat and it's gross"

That's just what I think the objection is, and of course it's a general you not you specifically.

It's actually quite naive to believe strangers really care about fat people's health. Most people who spend time criticizing other people's unhealthy habits are really just looking to pick on someone.

(February 13, 2016 at 12:50 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote:

Quote:Again, the problem is most people don't choose to become fat. Get it? It's not a choice! It's an aggregate combination of genetic and environmental factors that lead to weight problems and/or exacerbate them. So you can hardly say that this is their fault. Therefore, it would still be irrational of you to harshly criticize people for being of a certain weight.

Are you on drugs, or something? I only criticise those that obviously have a choice in the matter. The woman cited in the OP clearly had one. She went from one extreme too far over the other.

I never said anything about how many people have a choice in the matter, and I don't think you're qualified to make that claim either, not that it matters. If it can be shown that most people don't have a choice, then I won't criticize those people. Is this so hard for you to understand? Try reading what I'm saying slower - that might help perhaps.

You're being deceptive. She didn't go from one extreme to the other. What she chose to do was become more comfortable with no longer trying to meet the fucked up expectations of society regarding her weight. That is not her choosing to become fat (at least not the kind of fat I'm referring to). And if you think that's fat in an obvious sense, then something is wrong with you. And just as well, if you believe she's fat because she thinks she's fat, then something is still wrong with you. See, I can make personal attacks as well.

(February 13, 2016 at 6:33 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Attractiveness correlates with personality as well, not only physical appearance. I find her overall attitude very displeasing, and idiocy is never attractive to begin with.

I honestly don't think she's extreme either way. She was hardly emaciated skinny before, and it's a massive stretch to call her "fat" now.

I do have to say though, with VERY fat people (not her), I do think there is a level of choice to it. At one point you were the same size as everyone else, and I don't believe these people who sit there chatting some shit about "well I only eat salad and I'm still fat" girl not you don't. Stop that.

It's the bullshit I can't stand. I could care less about the health of random strangers, I'm not coming here with that plastic "oh your health!", just miss me with the bullshit. These people who sue McDonalds because "McDonalds made me fat!". No McDonalds didn't make you fat, you made yourself fat becuase you went to McDonalds 4 times a week and ordered the whole menu, let's be real.

Unless you have a thyroid problem (which 1/3 of The USA does not have) or a slow metabolism, you have no excuse. Even if you do have a thyroid problem, that would only make you somewhat overweight, not morbidly obese on its own.

I have more respect for fat people who just own it and say "yeah I'm fat, I love my food". I can't stand people bullshitting like they live a healthy lifestyle and somehow are still fat, or trying to act like being twice the weight of an average adult is a natural, normal body weight. When you do that, you're putting out the message to kids that it's normal and healthy, and that's the only bit of the whole "health" complex I seriously do take issue with.

But I absolutely maintain that the woman in the OP is not fat. She is at the bigger end of normal and she's insulting herself by claiming "fat". You can still plausibly be her size living a healthy lifestyle, she is the size of someone who genuinely does have a slow metabolism or maybe relatively mild thyroid disorder.

(February 13, 2016 at 12:11 pm)Napoléon Wrote: I wish people would fuck off making this some kind of sexism issue. The pressure on men is just as bad if not worse.

Really?

Ya I would say there is less pressure on men to keep their weight in check, for social reasons, I assume the health factors are pretty similar for both women and men who are overweight.

Honestly if I had the choice to date her before photo or her after photo, I'm choosing the after photo.

I think most of the pressure on men comes from other men rather than women. We live in a society where men are in a constant pissing contest to be the most masculine, the most respected etc etc. That's an attitude that breeds shame around being fat. It's "biggest dick syndrome", represented in body shape.

It's the same reason there appears to be so much pressure on short men, skinny men, the list goes on. Women will have their preferences sure, I've heard women say they won't date a guy under 5'9 or a bald guy, but I still think most of the "pressure" men face is to match up to other men, not so much to impress women. Therefore it's less of a sexism issue and more our own issue, it's the hypermasculine culture that needs addressing.