(July 21, 2016 at 4:30 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(July 21, 2016 at 3:52 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: If you think I'm exaggerating, you have obviously not travelled extensively. If anything I'm downplaying things. Take a stroll down main street, Jalalabad, and then we'll talk.

I lived at 43 Zafar St in Teheran for four years, and I do think you're exaggerating. I don't know if my address qualifies me to talk with you.

First, it's nice to meet you, provided you weren't a zoomie.   I appreciate the response, insomnia is hell.  

We have obviously had very different experiences in Muslim countries. Even so, Europe is finding out that Mosques are often weapons caches, which bothers me not only because of the probable intent, but because if only a small percentage of Muslims are indeed jihadist, why don't the majority take them down? Seems odd that the supposed VAST majority of Muslims who are peaceful would allow this tiny minority to destroy their standing in the world like this. 

(July 21, 2016 at 3:52 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: I didn't realize this site was about politics...perhaps the name should be changed. I try to respect others religious beliefs, even though, frankly, very religious people creep me out. It seems that respect isn't a part of the paradigm here. Shame.

I like this forum precisely because it doesn't restrict itself to discussing unicorns or gods.

I, too, like diversity in topics, but I didn't expect my first experience on a forum dedicated to atheism to be bashing my home state with ridiculous propaganda, either.

And I think I speak for quite a few here when I say that I'm comfortable respecting religious people so long as they don't shove their shit down my throat. Certainly there are some here, notably the OP, who are vociferous in their antitheism. Me, I'm fine with that. There's room for all at the table ... except assholes.

Agreed completely. I was raised Methodist, although not stringently. By the time I was in my very early teens I was verbally questioning the existence of God and had stopped attending church completely. I have 3 older brothers. none have much time for religion, but my sister, who is 10 years my senior, married (and later divorced) a southern Baptist, and converted. She is scary religious. And I do mean scary.

Now's the time when I should slink away from the table.

(July 21, 2016 at 3:52 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Finally, I saw a few people suggest Texas secede. We'd love to- we'd be absolutely fine. Texas gives the federal government more than it takes. Funny how NOT ONE SINGLE liberal state is financially solvent. Must be a coincidence. But back to secession...if you know anything at all, you will pray we don't. Trust me or not on this...but a little honest research into the matter might make your panties crawl right up your sphincter. Then again, liberals only believe what they really really want to be true, so it's wasted breath.

Cheers!

Well, I'm a somewhat conservative Texan -- Hill Country, west of Austin, Just Outside of Weird® -- and the view here is a little different, from what I gather. Secessionist feelings are tiny. I get what you're saying about finances, we give more into the Treasury than we draw, but let's face it, that is not the calling-card of the secessionistas; they appeal to pride and local patriotism. Were Texas to secede, my life wouldn't be very different one way or the other.

The largest effect it would have on America at large is that they'd have to count fewer votes for Republicans when tallying Electoral College votes.

Hmm, I basically agree, except the bit about no effect on America other than Republican votes. A large percentage of our military is from Texas, a significant number of bases are in Texas, many Defense contractors are based in Texas, production facilities, the aforementioned tax base is substantial, and the US already spends more than it earns. Texans are typically fairly militant, so you know we would quickly have a sizable and capable military of our own, which the contiguous states would feel obliged to defend against, if only theoretically. Expensive. I don't think it would all be cherries and vodka, but Texas would likely take less damage than the rest of the country.

Lastly, one Air Force veteran to another, thanks for your service -- and one musician to another, glad to meetcha --and welcome to the boards.

Same to you, and thank you! I'm assuming from your avatar you are a fellow guitar player? What type of music, primarily?

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(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Mathilda Wrote:

(July 21, 2016 at 3:52 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: I believe Liberals are self deluded. They want a world of unicorns and rainbows, where peace and love prevail and cats and dogs live in harmony and nobody eats meat. I have a few problems with that.

One, it sounds incredibly boring. I would go stir crazy in a week. We are apex predators, regardless what you think, and we are not built to sit around and stagnate. We must have challenges.

Two, and here is the big one- that sort of system will, literally, only work if EVERYONE is on board. One violent man takes the entire system down, because nobody in the society is equipped to deal with him.

You've got a very strange view of liberals and not one born out of reality but a common stereotype fed to you by a certain segment of the media. You are displaying binary thinking here and are bordering on a strawman argument. Also you are tarring a whole range of opinions into one homogeneous lump. Liberals as a whole don't believe a utopia of unicorns, rainbows and world peace is possible, but why should that stop people from trying to improve society as a whole? It is only ever going to be a process and we can decide which direction that process should take. We all benefit from a fairer society and we have all benefitted from the progress made so far. As more people are treated fairly and with respect then they are more likely to treat others in the same way. Animal welfare for example has improved alongside the improvement in quality of life for humans. People have the chance to innovate, to develop businesses and to specialise if society provides a safety net for them and provides equal rights.

With all respect, there is misinformation on both sides- this entire thread supposedly describing Texas is a prime example. But you sound...well, like a liberal. I think, if you have to ask those questions, the chances of you ever understanding my feelings is small. Respect...yes, respect is a good thing, but from what I've seen liberals don't believe it can be overdone, that there's such a thing as too much respect. Basically, at it's core, that concept has led to this ridiculous era of political correctness. 99% of the country doesn't matter as long as 1% doesn't feel bad. Good grief. Also, I'm not sure "Humans" quality of life has improved...certain countries, perhaps, but the majority...probably not. Have you ever visited China, just as a "for instance"?

Liberals are dangerously naive. Treat people with respect and they are more likely to treat others with respect? That is a very American way of thinking. The truth, however, is that many, many peoples of our little blue marble are much less "civilized", closer to the raw apex predator I mentioned- and predators are, by nature, opportunists. Spend some time in Asia or the middle east or eastern Europe or parts of Africa and then let's see how your "do unto others" plan worked out. I've spent my life traveling all over the globe, first in the military and then during my career as an airline pilot. I LIKE people- I'm not a hater, nor am I paranoid and delusional. I give people a chance, I am in no way racist, and I enjoy other cultures, I don't drag my own along with me. But I am a realist, and three-plus decades of travel have shown me that we Americans, as well as the Brits and many European countries, have let our own civilized lives pull a dark glass over our eyes. We think other cultures respond as we do, think as we do, value what we do. That is not only wrong, but dangerously wrong in the right circumstances.

As for growth and innovation...nothing inspires either like necessity, and historically, nothing inspires necessity like conflict.



And of course there are always going to be people trying to exploit this, or sociopaths who want to ruin everything, but it makes more sense to find out the most effective way as a society to cope with this rather than to pander to our basest emotions for seeking revenge and retribution.

Yes...you are correct about the existence of people who want to ruin YOUR plan for them, but they are not necessarily sociopaths by their countries' / cultures' standards, and I think you honestly believe they are the exception rather than the rule. Hmm.

What has being an apex predator got to do with sitting around and stagnating? The very fact that we have successes with the scientific method and the arts is evidence that as a species we do more than just eat, breed and compete with one another. It is possible, and indeed preferable to compete with yourself, to improve yourself rather than to stamp down on others. 

There it is...what I was talking about, that you labeled "very strange view of liberals and not one born out of reality but a common stereotype fed to you by a certain segment of the media". For some reason our predatory nature is abhorrent to liberals. I'll never understand that, I'm proud that we aren't living in trees afraid to come down.

Competition is what drives us- it doesn't have to involve violence, but it does by it's very nature require WINNERS AND LOSERS. Everybody gets a trophy...dumbest concept since Dr Spock. Our predatory nature is not something we can, or indeed should, shed. Predators are competitive- that's what makes them grow and evolve and succeed. 
A cow can sit around and stagnate happily...a shark will die in the same scenario. Predators have different brain physiology for a reason- we were not designed by evolution to sit around playing harps and painting pictures. Some like that sort of thing, sure- but they are the minority. If we all did, we would slowly devolve into beings unable to protect ourselves, and eventually, nature would select our successor. 

It's nice to meet you- please don't take offense, I enjoy debate and I listen to what you say...err, type, I really do. If anything came across as adversarial it was unintentional. Just passion!

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(July 21, 2016 at 4:30 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  (what'd you fly, where were you stationed?) 

Sorry, missed this. UPT at Sheppard, then faip'ed and a lot of time in tweets and talons with ATC, mostly Randolph and Laughlin, ultimately F15C's and F-5E's with the 65th TFAS at Nellis. 

(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Same to you, and thank you! I'm assuming from your avatar you are a fellow guitar player? What type of music, primarily?

I am indeed. I play rock, blues, and a little jazz, some classical as well. I'm just getting an electric rig back together after five+ years of playing acoustic-only.

(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Sorry, missed this. UPT at Sheppard, then faip'ed and a lot of time in tweets and talons with ATC, mostly Randolph and Laughlin, ultimately F15C's and F-5E's with the 65th TFAS at Nellis. 

Sweet. I was a firefighter at Carswell back before it closed. Our main basing was H-model 52s, and the 301st TFW (Reserve) had F-16s. We had a flight of Tweets for flight-pay hours, too. Pretty sure those little bastards took more of my hearing than my cranked amps did ...

Yep. You're a Texan.  One of the worst kind.

Nothing annoys me more than conservatards who want to shove their fucking jesus everywhere he isn't wanted. 

Keep electing those fascist shitbags.  You deserve everything you get.

ImaginaryFriendless, I'm not going to reply to your post because your quoting is all messed up. But you clearly think of whole groups of people thinking and acting alike and make far too many assumptions about how other people think. You don't know anything about me, my history or even where I am from yet you've already started making erroneous assumptions.

I have to say though, you are living up to the Texan stereotype quite well.

I'm a Texan; although, not the typical gun toting, beer guzzling, religion spewing type...

IDK if anyone posted this (I'm not looking through all 15 pages.) Y'all might get a kick outta this though...

(Sorry, a little of my Texas came out)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYV7KWQ-fY4#t=274.5094

(July 21, 2016 at 11:56 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Same to you, and thank you! I'm assuming from your avatar you are a fellow guitar player? What type of music, primarily?

I am indeed. I play rock, blues, and a little jazz, some classical as well. I'm just getting an electric rig back together after five+ years of playing acoustic-only.

(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Sorry, missed this. UPT at Sheppard, then faip'ed and a lot of time in tweets and talons with ATC, mostly Randolph and Laughlin, ultimately F15C's and F-5E's with the 65th TFAS at Nellis. 

Sweet. I was a firefighter at Carswell back before it closed. Our main basing was H-model 52s, and the 301st TFW (Reserve) had F-16s. We had a flight of Tweets for flight-pay hours, too. Pretty sure those little bastards took more of my hearing than my cranked amps did ...

I'm hard rock and metal, 1970 to 1990 more or less, with a love for blues as well. I grew up playing with my friends, who all wanted to be guitar players in a metal band as well- we had a helluva time finding bass players or drummers, it was the era of the Guitar God. We all moved all over the world, in our respective jobs...somehow most of us ended up back here, so I have a large "man cave" full of guitars and amps and all the goodies, and the same guys get together and do the same thing 30 years later. Feels rather surreal sometimes. Fewer mind-altering substances these days, but the booze still flows, albeit more slowly. I miss being invincible.

Always loved the H model Buffs, which a fighter jock should never admit. The planes have a long and distinguished history, and just keep getting more capable.

Ah, the venerable Tweet, or more affectionately, the Converter. For those not familiar, it's a 2 seat trainer built by Cessna for the military- there is even an attack version some countries used, even the US in a limited fashion during the VN war. We used it for primary jet instruction, formation flying, instrument flying, etc.  Called the Converter because it is very good at converting jet fuel into noise. The size of the air inlets on the two Continental J69-T-25 turbojet engines produce a high pitched shriek that will make your bones hurt. 50+ years of service. RIP, my old friend.

So do you gig at all or just play for self/friends? I have an embarrassingly large guitar collection, I'll let you know next time we're having a jam session, in case you'd like to come by. I think you're an hour away or less. We just have fun, no rules, no plans, just music and hanging out.

Cheers!

(July 21, 2016 at 1:24 pm)mediocrates Wrote: I'm a Texan; although, not the typical gun toting, beer guzzling, religion spewing type...

IDK if anyone posted this (I'm not looking through all 15 pages.) Y'all might get a kick outta this though...

(Sorry, a little of my Texas came out)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYV7KWQ-fY4#t=274.5094

Excellent.

(July 21, 2016 at 1:01 pm)Mathilda Wrote: ImaginaryFriendless, I'm not going to reply to your post because your quoting is all messed up. But you clearly think of whole groups of people thinking and acting alike and make far too many assumptions about how other people think. You don't know anything about me, my history or even where I am from yet you've already started making erroneous assumptions.

I have to say though, you are living up to the Texan stereotype quite well.

Yes indeed, you are everything I've come to expect from a liberal. I'm expressing my opinion based on my life- which you know nothing about- and I am doing so respectfully. As usual, liberals start with thinly veiled personal insults, and will quickly escalate to name calling and ridicule. You are generalizing much more than I am, kitten.

You all seem to think Texans are just waiting for the revolution to begin. Hey, finally! You got one right. 

Liberals believe their own silly propaganda and stereotypes...it's what they're good at, self delusion. Republicans have fought for the rights of minorities and women, and have been behind EVERY significant piece of legislature to create racial and gender equality. Yet liberal democrats continually act as though Republicans are the enemy of equality and have "beaten down" the blacks, or Puerto Ricans, etc. That is because without the minority vote, the democrats would be completely ineffective. They work hard to not only keep minorities from being equal, but to make certain the minorities know the Evil Republicans are to blame. Yes, that's a party to be proud of.
I'm not saying the Republican party is perfect- far, far from it. I disagree with a great deal the GOP does (or doesn't do), particularly lately. But they don't keep a race of people enslaved for their own personal gain and political power. 

I have no doubt you don't believe anything I'm saying about Republicans and racial equality. I have no doubt I will not change your mind about anything. I have no doubt you will go to your grave hating everyone who doesn't believe as you do. I also have no doubt that I couldn't give a rat's ass.

Cheers!

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(July 21, 2016 at 12:42 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Yep. You're a Texan.  One of the worst kind.

Nothing annoys me more than conservatards who want to shove their fucking jesus everywhere he isn't wanted. 

Keep electing those fascist shitbags.  You deserve everything you get.

Hmm. I'm an atheist. No offense, but I hear "Hooked on Phonics" is well worth the money. You hang in there now!

As to the rest...Thank You! 

Nothing, except perhaps a large juicy steak, makes me happier than seeing a liberal resort to name calling and juvenile behavior. Again...thank you! You really are a sweetheart.

I'm curious...is your screen name a reference to your philosophy or your IQ? 

I'm betting on the latter!

Cheers!

(July 22, 2016 at 2:07 am)Imaginaryfriendless Wrote: Yes indeed, you are everything I've come to expect from a liberal. I'm expressing my opinion based on my life- which you know nothing about- and I am doing so respectfully. As usual, liberals start with thinly veiled personal insults, and will quickly escalate to name calling and ridicule. You are generalizing much more than I am, kitten.

Directly quote where I have generalised. The only possible candidate I can find is:

(July 21, 2016 at 4:55 am)Mathilda Wrote: Liberals as a whole don't believe a utopia of unicorns, rainbows and world peace is possible, but why should that stop people from trying to improve society as a whole?

So please, back up your accusation with evidence from my posts on this thread or admit that your interpretation of what is being said to you is coloured by your own prejudices. If you want I can quote where you have generalised and we can compare lists.

"I'm not going to reply to your post because your quoting is all messed up."

My apologies, I've been busy defending the country and raising three children and saving lives and earning a living...oh, sorry, you are a liberal...ok,"Earning a living" is where a person uses a skill he possesses to obtain a job...crap...ok, a "Job" is a place you go where a person pays you money in exchange for your labor or knowledge....ok, so "earning a living" is where a person goes to a job (see above) and stays there all week long, usually 40 hours or more, and gets paid at the end of every week, or two weeks, usually. Over time, this money adds up, and the person uses that money to pay for things he or she needs to live. I realize liberals think money falls out of fairies' asses when they sneeze, but actually it is earned by people who DON'T take money from the government in exchange for playing video games or sitting at computers all day spouting their world views on forums.

Anyway, I'm new to forums, and don't know how to use the quote feature- well, I'm learning, but these few posts are the only ones I've ever written. Excuse my unfamiliarity.

I think it's classic deflection and avoidance, but...you can call it a problem with my quoting if you want to. I won't tell.
Cheers!