(September 19, 2016 at 5:17 am)abaris Wrote: First, the good news, she survived.

Secondly, I was surprised that this is even newsworthy on here until I saw it was a Nigerian man. Now I know the reason why.

Yes, how dare we report the crimes of black people.

(September 19, 2016 at 4:57 am)Yeauxleaux Wrote: I think it's more of a punishment for a child molester to go to jail tbh, because they get (putting it lightly) bullied by the other inmates.

There's that. I know that if I were ever convicted of a capital crime I'd prefer and ask for death rather than life.

As I said, my rationale is not logically defensible, and I suppose if we get down to it, it's because as a child I was myself molested, and think of molesters as vermin to be stamped out. Probably a bit heartless on my part, but hey-ho.

(September 19, 2016 at 5:21 am)abaris Wrote:

(September 19, 2016 at 4:12 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: 2) People involved in murder-for-hire. if you value money more than life, you're incurable.

That's where I disagree. That should rather read serial killers. Hitman aren't incurable, they're doing it just for the money. Serial killers on the other hand are predators, doing it for the thrill.

I'm not for capital punishment in any case. Locking them away does the same job and there's always a margin of error in convictions. Can be corrected if the person is jailes, cannot be corrected if the person is six feet under.

Your point about serial killers is apt -- gosh, I may have to add a third category.

In seriousness, intellectually I'm completely against the death penalty, for exactly the reason you state, and also because, as I stated earlier, I think the incarcerated life is unworth living, and for that reason, that much more useful. The State gets to back down if shown wrong, the inmate gets that many more years to ponder his misdeed and perhaps come to repentance.

I say bring back the old "chain gangs" and put them to work for the community. If the tax payer is going to pay for the incarcerated they better get something back.

To broaden the conversation, let's be clear, state-sanctioned murder is not justice. The death penalty is immoral and only justifiable by using revenge as a criterion. It's been shown to be ineffective as either a punishment or a deterrent and is even less effective than incarceration.

I'm opposed to current forms of punitive incarceration as I'm a believer of invitational rather than coercive ethics. I believe that rehabilitation and restitution should be the aims of state justice with people only being freed once they have accomplished both. If that means a shoplifter does 20 years but a murderer does 5 then so be it: as long as the person is fit to be reintroduced to society under the 2 criteria, the time served is appropriate. I'm also aware that would mean some people would never be set free (e.g. murdererous psycho/sociopaths).

In practice, we're quite a way away from invitational justice models because there's not enough investment in to:

1. the psychology to understand how we can properly rehabilitate people
2. educating the number of psychologists that would be needed to support them
3. the support that people need to re-enter society
4. the public understanding that rehabilitation is possible & desirable.

Until society & governments truly understand that people who break the law are still people to whom they have responsibilities, we're not likely to see the appropriate level of investment.


P.S. @Arkilogue are you really supporting the prison industrial complex?

(September 19, 2016 at 6:12 am)Ben Davis Wrote: I believe that rehabilitation and restitution should be the aims of state justice with people only being freed once they have accomplished both. If that means a shoplifter does 20 years but a murderer does 5 then so be it: [...]

What do you think is the appropriate restitution for murder? How would you pay the victim back for his suffering?

(September 19, 2016 at 5:22 am)Bella Morte Wrote:

(September 19, 2016 at 5:17 am)abaris Wrote: First, the good news, she survived.

Secondly, I was surprised that this is even newsworthy on here until I saw it was a Nigerian man. Now I know the reason why.

Yes, how dare we report the crimes of black people. They are obviously a superior race in the eyes of lefties and are above crime. We should bow down and obey them.

I'm sorry for being white!

Firstly, Abaris, Robert E was only commenting on the crime and deserved punishment.
Nothing in the any of his wording seems racist to me at all.

Secondly, Belle, your sarcasm makes no sense after the first sentence.
I know you're young but try to think before you write.

(September 19, 2016 at 9:35 am)Little lunch Wrote:

(September 19, 2016 at 5:22 am)Bella Morte Wrote: Yes, how dare we report the crimes of black people. They are obviously a superior race in the eyes of lefties and are above crime. We should bow down and obey them.

I'm sorry for being white!

Firstly, Abaris, Robert E was only commenting on the crime and deserved punishment.
Nothing in the any of his wording seems racist to me at all.

Secondly, Belle, your sarcasm makes no sense after the first sentence.
I know you're young but try to think before you write.

Happy?

There's nothing wrong with reporting black crime.
It's only when it's done selectively and repeatedly, with an obvious agenda.
Which was not done in this thread until now.

(September 18, 2016 at 11:27 pm)Losty Wrote: I don't think he deserved the death penalty

It is the United Kingdom, he will get out in 5 years instead of doing the full 20 years and then he will get a knighthood from the queen.