(July 26, 2017 at 8:39 pm)chimp3 Wrote: Trump wants to be sure that when he goes to grab an unsuspecting female soldiers pussy he does not get a fistful of cock.

...and then a cockful of fist, and dropped to the floor. That's proper military etiquette, amiright?

And what is the Army going to do with no trans in their fighting vehicles? /(bad) mechanic joke

Quote:"The military should care for its service members, fact. But the job of the military is not to make everyone feel comfortable and happy, it's to go to dangerous places on earth and kick ass. The military does and should reasonably accommodate people based on their needs. Repealing don't ask don't tell was a win and 100% sound. However, accommodating transgenders falls into the unreasonable category. Hormone treatment, surgery etc on tax payers dollars while soldiers, airmen and marines are going to war with broken equipment and coming back in body bags is what is shameful. Taking someone out of a few deployment cycles for hormone treatment while the other guy or gal is on their 4th deployment and fixing a broken marriage is what is shameful. This is not to demean transgender people, is it demeaning to not allowed handicapped people to serve? Of course not."

False dichotomy it argues we have to choose one or the other . As for the marriage comment false equivocation

Quote:"As stated elsewhere, not all transgender people undergo hormones therapy. If this is such a massive concern (curious if there are any documented cases of readiness suffering here), then make the treatment a disqualifier. But simply banning transgendered folks from serving isn't much more than bullying."

There is zero evidence of readiness suffering . It's just as silly as the whole gays will be black mailed argument.

Quote:- "I think it's more about the needs of the military, it is designed to meet the needs of war. You have one applicant that can ship and meet the needs very easliy and one that will comes with alot of added bs. In the state of the military today this doesn't not even make the top 10 of things that need to worried about. Glad it got put on hold we can readdress this later when the miltary has time to change to meet the needs of every person. I am sure then we can stop thinking of the military as serving our country and just demand they alter to fit our needs. Doesn't really make a effective military though"

Once again false dichotomy

Quote:- "Also they need to be deployable that is pretty much the #1 thing of importance."

Fallacy of composition not to mention straight up simplistic

Quote:- "Everybody seems focused on the costs and such. What about the issue when 20 of us women are in a communal shower and in walks a swinging dick and the rest have to suppress their own discomfort and they can't lodge a formal protest because nobody wants to be labelled a "trans-phobe.""

Get over it . I have to look at ugly old man dicks in communal showers and worst I don't here whining  . It's nothing you likely have not seen before nor is it going to leap out and bit you.

Quote:- "Caring for them doesn't mean providing years of treatments and medical procedures to provide them with a medically non-necessary transition. There is nothing wrong with being transgender. But there is also nothing wrong with the military, a group of individuals with one singular purpose, to say they don't want to deal with it."

So does the purpose include Viagra and prayer guns sights . halal and kosher food. parades and posing for photo ops etc etc etc

Quote:- "Haha well that sort of backs me up! There are people who have been denied entry into the military for far less debilitating conditions than "gender dysphoria"... I guess you're one of the lucky ones for whom DoD could spare $20 for shoe inserts to treat your condition "

Prove it's debilitating condition . And once again false  dichotomy

Quote:- "Trump hasn't announced what will happen with transgenders already in the military... He's just saying we won't accept any in the future. Kind of like how we already don't accept people with asthma, flat feet, and all manner of debilitating, expensive-to-treat conditions."

Prove it's debilitating condition. And transgender is not a disability like flat feet or asthma these people are idiots.

---

The most comprehensive study on Trans on combat readiness was done in Canada before Trans were permitted to serve .It found no serious effects on combat readiness . So this disability argument is bullocks .

(July 26, 2017 at 10:32 pm)Fireball Wrote:

(July 26, 2017 at 8:39 pm)chimp3 Wrote: Trump wants to be sure that when he goes to grab an unsuspecting female soldiers pussy he does not get a fistful of cock.

...and then a cockful of fist, and dropped to the floor. That's proper military etiquette, amiright?

And what is the Army going to do with no trans in their fighting vehicles? /(bad) mechanic joke

I grew up in the '70's. We had the draft back then. Discovering that you enjoyed a fistful of cock saved you a trip to Montreal.

(July 26, 2017 at 11:28 pm)chimp3 Wrote:

(July 26, 2017 at 10:32 pm)Fireball Wrote: ...and then a cockful of fist, and dropped to the floor. That's proper military etiquette, amiright?

And what is the Army going to do with no trans in their fighting vehicles? /(bad) mechanic joke

I grew up in the '70's. We had the draft back then. Discovering that you enjoyed a fistful of cock saved you a trip to Montreal.

I graduated high school in 1970, and yes indeed, I have seen that. I'm not gay, so I couldn't use that excuse. I was a volunteer ('72, did not get drafted), anyway. The thing is, I wanted to be an Electronics Technician, but my mechanical scores were high enough to get me stuck in the engine room. If I had known, I would have made my test responses more incorrect (I'm incapable of lying, though, even on a test). I had been doing mechanical work on vehicles from the age of 12, and recall repacking the wheel bearings on the front of my parent's '66 Dodge wagon at the tender age of 15, and sweating bullets when my dad drove it to work after that, afraid that a wheel would fall off, or something.

Meh, I don't think it's right to tell a woman who feels uncomfortable with a naked biological male showering close to her own naked body that she just needs to "get over it" as though she's being petty or whatever.

For the record, I'm not saying the naked shower thing is a legitimate reason to not let trans folks join. There are ways of solving that issue. I'm just saying I don't like the response of "get over it" to women who would understandably feel uncomfortable being naked around a naked male body who is not her significant other, even if that person identifies as female. I certainly wouldn't.

"A fistful of cock" sounds like the title of a cowboy themed gay porno.

(July 26, 2017 at 11:01 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: The most comprehensive study on Trans on combat readiness was done in Canada before Trans were permitted to serve .It found no serious effects on combat readiness . So this disability argument is bullocks .

Well from my understanding, the disability argument people have been using isn't that trans folks wouldn't be able to perform well. It's that they would need to take a lot of time off for surgeries and therapies, and would not be deployable because the treatments they need aren't available overseas. And there's also the issue of costs to the military that could go towards safer equipment, newer planes, etc. That is their argument as far as "disabilities" goes.

But again, the way I see it, there's a simple solution to this - don't do these surgeries/therapies while on active duty status, don't include reassignment surgery in the insurance plan. I personally don't see how banning all trans people outright is necessary here. If that's the only argument they have, that's a pretty weak one IMHO.

(July 27, 2017 at 12:16 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Meh, I don't think it's right to tell a woman who feels uncomfortable with a naked biological male showering close to her own naked body that she just needs to "get over it" as though she's being petty or whatever.  

For the record, I'm not saying the naked shower thing is a legitimate reason to not let trans folks join. There are ways of solving that issue. I'm just saying I don't like the response of "get over it" to women who would understandably feel uncomfortable being naked around a naked male body who is not her significant other, even if that person identifies as female. I certainly wouldn't.

In college one of my dorms at least for that summer semester had a co ed bathroom. You know how many sexual assaults happened in that bathroom? NONE! Now, it wasn't like boys and girls were walking around naked in front of each other. The toilet stalls had doors, and the showers had curtains. The worst I ever saw was a robe. 

It is a myth that people not like you that you are not familiar with will assault you. When it comes to child molestation or even adult rape or assault, the victim is far more likely to be assaulted by someone they are familiar with than a complete stranger. If you have no problem with women or gays serving in the military then you should have no problem with Trans. 

If you think a trans man or trans woman is thinking about assaulting you in the context of combat, that is just fucking nuts. The last thing I would be thinking about in the context of combat would be sex. 

Trans and gays probably, just like women, have far more to fear being assaulted by bigoted men, than you do.

Quote:Well from my understanding, the disability argument people have been using isn't that trans folks wouldn't be able to perform well. It's that they would need to take a lot of time off for surgeries and therapies, and would not be deployable because the treatments they need aren't available overseas. And there's also the issue of costs to the military that could go towards safer equipment, newer planes, etc. That is their argument as far as "disabilities" goes.

Study already addressed that the recovery time is not much greater then standard injuries and in some cases less so. And the cost argument does not work because it's moderate at best compared to other shit the military wastes money on . like the 5 times  cost on freaking Viagra were those people going on about that ? I think not.

I never said anything about sexual assault. Maybe it's a women thing that men don't get, but many of us wouldn't feel comfortable being naked in front of another naked male body who is not our partner or our doctor. It's a privacy/embarrassment thing, not a fear of sexual assault thing.