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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:16 pm
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2017 at 9:18 pm by Bow Before Zeus.)
(November 21, 2017 at 7:34 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 7:25 pm)Succubus Wrote: All marriages are civil marriages, there is no such thing as a sacramental marriage. Two people married by a priest are not married until they sign the papers, state papers. Other than that, I don't have the remotest idea what you're talking about.
Again, what objective essential feature distinguishes a marriage from any other relationship or social institution, like roommates, business partners, care-givers with power of attorney, and the like?
A marriage gives certain legal rights that even a de-facto relationship does not let alone "roommates, etc, etc". For example, if as a gay person your partner ends up in hospital, in an unresponsive state and a decision needs to be made to approve a certain surgical procedure, a de-facto partner does not have the legal right to make that decision but a married partner does. Gay couples just want the same legal rights that the rest of the community has.
(November 21, 2017 at 7:35 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: How old are you? It almost feels like I'm talking to yet another person suffering from chronic victim mentality.
We already have one of those.
Firstly, how can I have a "victim mentality" when I am not gay? Secondly, what has my age to do with it? Thirdly, why as an atheist are you so adamant about protecting the rights of religious institutions to discriminate?
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:20 pm
(November 21, 2017 at 7:34 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 7:25 pm)Succubus Wrote: All marriages are civil marriages, there is no such thing as a sacramental marriage. Two people married by a priest are not married until they sign the papers, state papers. Other than that, I don't have the remotest idea what you're talking about.
Again, what objective essential feature distinguishes a marriage from any other relationship or social institution, like roommates, business partners, care-givers with power of attorney, and the like?
You, and only you, brought up the nonsense that is sacramental marriage. So again, what the fuck are you talking about?
It's amazing 'science' always seems to 'find' whatever it is funded for, and never the oppsite. Drich.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:22 pm
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2017 at 9:26 pm by Bow Before Zeus.)
(November 21, 2017 at 7:59 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote: first, discrimination against gays is by no means different from racism. In fact, it's usually the same assholes who do it.
Second, for everyone the church discriminates against, that's fewer tithes and offerings for them, so I'm all for it. The fewer blacks duped by xtianity the better.
Do Australians use the Justice of the Peace to marry people? I was married by a judge (should have asked for a jury, but...)
We have civil celebrants but I'm not sure who can/can't marry people as I've never looked into it.
(November 21, 2017 at 4:10 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:This time I am going to try to be a little more compassionate and considerate with the feelings of the xtians here
This will be boring.
I could have called the thread "Christians are bigoted, discriminatory assholes" but hopefully most posters will get the message from the rest of the thread. 
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:32 pm
(November 21, 2017 at 9:16 pm)Bow Before Zeus Wrote:
(November 21, 2017 at 7:35 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: How old are you? It almost feels like I'm talking to yet another person suffering from chronic victim mentality.
We already have one of those.
Firstly, how can I have a "victim mentality" when I am not gay? Secondly, what has my age to do with it? Thirdly, why as an atheist are you so adamant about protecting the rights of religious institutions to discriminate?
Because you are irrationally whining like a victim. Because your posts/responses lack real world experience. I'm not adamant about religion. I think it's a mental crutch. But private institutions do not have conform to some public laws.
Example: In dry counties where it is illegal to buy and sell alcohol you can join "social clubs" where drinking is allowed. Is it discrimination to keep non club members out? They want to drink also. By your reasoning they are humans so they should be let in without being a member. Being a male should you be let into an all woman's gym? Being a non smoker should you be able to insist that people stop smoking in a private cigar bar?
Are you starting to get it yet?
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:53 pm
(November 21, 2017 at 9:32 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 9:16 pm)Bow Before Zeus Wrote:
Firstly, how can I have a "victim mentality" when I am not gay? Secondly, what has my age to do with it? Thirdly, why as an atheist are you so adamant about protecting the rights of religious institutions to discriminate?
Because you are irrationally whining like a victim. Because your posts/responses lack real world experience. I'm not adamant about religion. I think it's a mental crutch. But private institutions do not have conform to some public laws.
Example: In dry counties where it is illegal to buy and sell alcohol you can join "social clubs" where drinking is allowed. Is it discrimination to keep non club members out? They want to drink also. By your reasoning they are humans so they should be let in without being a member. Being a male should you be let into an all woman's gym? Being a non smoker should you be able to insist that people stop smoking in a private cigar bar?
Are you starting to get it yet?
You heard it here first guys, mh.brewer will be putting up the "Whites Only" signs throughout America!
Ethics is ethics my friend and you can give all sorts of examples you like but when racists and bigots are given free reign the world is the worse for it.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 9:57 pm
(November 21, 2017 at 9:53 pm)Bow Before Zeus Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 9:32 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: Because you are irrationally whining like a victim. Because your posts/responses lack real world experience. I'm not adamant about religion. I think it's a mental crutch. But private institutions do not have conform to some public laws.
Example: In dry counties where it is illegal to buy and sell alcohol you can join "social clubs" where drinking is allowed. Is it discrimination to keep non club members out? They want to drink also. By your reasoning they are humans so they should be let in without being a member. Being a male should you be let into an all woman's gym? Being a non smoker should you be able to insist that people stop smoking in a private cigar bar?
Are you starting to get it yet?
You heard it here first guys, mh.brewer will be putting up the "Whites Only" signs throughout America!
Ethics is ethics my friend and you can give all sorts of examples you like but when racists and bigots are given free reign the world is the worse for it.
Perfect example of no real world experience. Thanks for proving my point.
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 11:34 pm
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2017 at 11:45 pm by Succubus.)
(November 21, 2017 at 9:22 pm)Bow Before Zeus Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 7:59 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote: first, discrimination against gays is by no means different from racism. In fact, it's usually the same assholes who do it.
Second, for everyone the church discriminates against, that's fewer tithes and offerings for them, so I'm all for it. The fewer blacks duped by xtianity the better.
Do Australians use the Justice of the Peace to marry people? I was married by a judge (should have asked for a jury, but...)
We have civil celebrants but I'm not sure who can/can't marry people as I've never looked into it.
(November 21, 2017 at 4:10 pm)Minimalist Wrote: This will be boring.
I could have called the thread "Christians are bigoted, discriminatory assholes" but hopefully most posters will get the message from the rest of the thread.
And no doubt that would have been followed by the obligatory:
Help! I'm being oppressed! I'm going to report you for..
Ah fuckit never mind.
But then again, there's time yet. Never miss out on an opportunity to declare how downtrodden you are.
Catholics: One thousand one hundred million.
Atheist: We don't know because we don't give enough of a fuck to count them.
It's amazing 'science' always seems to 'find' whatever it is funded for, and never the oppsite. Drich.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 11:46 pm
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2017 at 11:47 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 21, 2017 at 7:07 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Lots of diversion, none of which addresses my point that a secular civil marriage has an essential objective character that distinguishes it from other types of relationships and social institutions.
No, it doesn't. You think a ghost blesses one kind of marriage but not another. That's not objective or essential. You're angling for a justification for your predisposition to inequality. Good luck.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 11:52 pm
(November 21, 2017 at 11:46 pm)Khemikal Wrote: (November 21, 2017 at 7:07 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Lots of diversion, none of which addresses my point that a secular civil marriage has an essential objective character that distinguishes it from other types of relationships and social institutions.
No, it doesn't. You think a ghost blesses one kind of marriage but not another. That's not objective or essential. You're angling for a justification for your predisposition to inequality. Good luck.
I am making no references to religion, only civil law. What, according to you, makes a marriage distinct from other social institutions? What defining feature makes a marriage a marriage and not some other type of relationship? Stop with the distractions and blather.
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RE: Freedom from religion
November 21, 2017 at 11:54 pm
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2017 at 11:55 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Perhaps you should simply defer to law on this matter? It's not as if there isn't a legal distinction between a roommate and a spouse? The question is idiotic on it's face.
Full stop.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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