Has anyone here seen a documentary called The Red Pill?

It was made by a very feminist woman who set out to document The Men's Rights Movement (expecting to criticise it), but found herself actually agreeing with them. At the end of the documentary she says she no longer calls herself a feminist and is now a supporter of Men's Rights.

Anyway, it's on Amazon Prime and is an interesting watch.

My opinion after watching it is that both men and women have certain (different) disadvantages in society, and that many feminist movements are out of line in making themselves the victims all the time and actually being against men.

(December 19, 2017 at 1:09 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Has anyone here seen a documentary called The Red Pill?

It was made by a very feminist woman who set out to document The Men's Rights Movement (expecting to criticise it), but found herself actually agreeing with them. At the end of the documentary she says she no longer calls herself a feminist and is now a supporter of Men's Rights.

Anyway, it's on Amazon Prime and is an interesting watch.

My opinion after watching it is that both men and women have certain (different) disadvantages in society, and that many feminist movements are out of line in making themselves the victims all the time and actually being against men.

While there are definite concerns about the fairness of child custody, I see the more recent incarnation of "men's rights" as trying to hop on the victim bandwagon, since victim status now-a-days seems to carry with its own set of advantages - like making excuses for a lack of achievement and permission to whine for concessions. The way I see it the world is not always a binary win or lose circumstance. One person having an advantage doesn't necessary mean someone else is being oppressed.

Now in the 1990's there was a so-called men's movement - from Promise Keeper's to Robert Bly's "Iron John". There was a lot of talk about boys not having male role models to 'initiate' them into manhood. At the time, it sounded to me like a lot of know-it-all baby boomers preaching to the GenX guys about how to be be the men boomers failed to be as drug-taking free-love hippies. And of course you could pay $$$$ to go to a retreat, organized by said hippies, to run through the woods naked making primal screams. Dicks.

Feminism in the US is pretty dumb. I have my doubts whether the people steering the narrative for feminism are even interested in women's rights, or if they are just trying to make a buck off the movement and/or lock up a voting demographic.

The whole 'fuck all men'. Also 'fuck about half the women.' And while we're at it, let's ignore black women. There's no reason for women's rights to alienate anyone, and yet here we are with 70% of the country making a jerk-off motion when someone says they are a feminist.

men's rights/women's rights/black rights... e.t.c all start with valid reasons and noble intentions, but in due time all of them forget the concept of equality and devolve into the same "look-at-me-I-am-the-biggest-victim" movement.

I don't think much of MRAs. I didn't bother asking them for help defending my rights as a father. I rolled up my sleeves and got to work myself, while they were busy griping about how men get screwed. Weird thing happened -- I got 42% custody without even retaining a lawyer.

All it took was time at the law library and the willingness to fight it out.

I like the Men's Rights movement as a concept, just as I like feminism as a concept, but both fall short because of their proponents' shortcomings. For example, I abhor the way sexual abuse is treated when it comes to men. I've had a feminist tell me that men raping women is "more of a problem" than anyone raping men/boys, so it should be given more focus. That disgusts me, but then I go into the Men's Rights subreddit, and I sympathize with feminists. This is a very nuanced issue with both genders having fair complaints.

Yes, men do have disadvantages in society. Funnily enough, due to traditional gender role expectations, which feminists are fighting against. Hence why being "very feminist" (as OP says it) is a very good thing to be.

(December 19, 2017 at 1:59 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: And of course you could pay $$$$ to go to a retreat, organized by said hippies, to run through the woods naked making primal screams.

If you're paying someone for the privilege of running naked through the woods and baying at the moon, you have more problems than not being initiated into 'manhood'. You're an idiot.

#someweirdnessisfree

(December 19, 2017 at 2:41 pm)Grandizer Wrote: Yes, men do have disadvantages in society. Funnily enough, due to traditional gender role expectations, which feminists are fighting against. Hence why being "very feminist" (as OP says it) is a very good thing to be.

Depends on the feminist. As I said, there are those who don't give a shit about problems men might have. They only care about traditional gender roles as far as it encumbers them. Talk to them about how traditional gender roles make it hard for men to talk about sexual abuse and they couldn't care less. Being "very feminist" is often a very obnoxious thing to be.

I think the issue is that men's rights movements tend to get laughed at or dismissed, while everyone else's is taken much more seriously.

In the documentary there was a huge protest by angry screaming feminists at an MRA meeting. One of them actually pulled the fire alarm and ruined the whole thing.