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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 9:47 am
(May 16, 2012 at 8:02 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: As i said from that web site yes it is.
Unless of course you are referring to the potential warming as staving off an Ice age?
No it is not in doubt. AGW is real, and is acknowledged as such by the vast majority of climate scientists and many others, including myself, a geologist. The question is not is AGW valid; it is. The question is what can be done do reduce manmade GHG emissions to mitigate further human induced warming.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 9:59 am
The question is: We are living in our craddle, should we destroy it before we are ready to grow out of it? do we want to?
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 10:07 am
(This post was last modified: May 16, 2012 at 10:08 am by KichigaiNeko.)
Agreed LP. Humans are the only creatures that "shit in their own nests"
(May 16, 2012 at 9:47 am)orogenicman Wrote: (May 16, 2012 at 8:02 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: As i said from that web site yes it is.
Unless of course you are referring to the potential warming as staving off an Ice age?
No it is not in doubt. AGW is real, and is acknowledged as such by the vast majority of climate scientists and many others, including myself, a geologist. The question is not is AGW valid; it is. The question is what can be done do reduce manmade GHG emissions to mitigate further human induced warming.
Sorry Orogenicman but the public are no longer listening ....
Such as it is. 
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 10:23 am
AGW shouldn't even be the real debate. The very real and growing danger to our planet is our pollution, there are so many toxins, chemicals and poisons leeching into our drinking water, radioactive crap, acid mine drainage is also becoming a concern.
We're a messy species and we've done a wonderful job of turning our habitable planet into a disgusting toxic shit-hole.
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 1:26 pm
(This post was last modified: May 16, 2012 at 1:26 pm by orogenicman.)
(May 16, 2012 at 10:07 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: Agreed LP. Humans are the only creatures that "shit in their own nests"
(May 16, 2012 at 9:47 am)orogenicman Wrote: No it is not in doubt. AGW is real, and is acknowledged as such by the vast majority of climate scientists and many others, including myself, a geologist. The question is not is AGW valid; it is. The question is what can be done do reduce manmade GHG emissions to mitigate further human induced warming.
Sorry Orogenicman but the public are no longer listening ....
Such as it is.
I know a lot of deniers want people to believe that. Thing is, not only is that not true, it is irrelevant since science is not a popularity contest.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 16, 2012 at 1:40 pm
Quote:Continuing to build on such disaster-prone land is irrational.
I agree, Oro. Of course, I make the same point every year when Oklahoma gets flattened by tornadoes.
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 17, 2012 at 2:00 am
(This post was last modified: May 17, 2012 at 2:05 am by KichigaiNeko.)
(May 16, 2012 at 10:23 am)Welsh cake Wrote: AGW shouldn't even be the real debate. The very real and growing danger to our planet is our pollution, there are so many toxins, chemicals and poisons leeching into our drinking water, radioactive crap, acid mine drainage is also becoming a concern.
We're a messy species and we've done a wonderful job of turning our habitable planet into a disgusting toxic shit-hole.
Totally agree there Welsh. We have recently had our "Carbon Tax" morph into "Emissions Tax" which morphed into "Green Incentive Scheme" like WTF?? It is starting to sound more and more like a $$ grab and less like "we are REALLY trying to clean up our mess"
(May 16, 2012 at 9:47 am)orogenicman Wrote: (May 16, 2012 at 8:02 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: As i said from that web site yes it is.
Unless of course you are referring to the potential warming as staving off an Ice age?
No it is not in doubt. AGW is real, and is acknowledged as such by the vast majority of climate scientists and many others, including myself, a geologist. The question is not is AGW valid; it is. The question is what can be done do reduce manmade GHG emissions to mitigate further human induced warming.
What like reducing water vapour?? Which seems to be the primary culprit of GHG. nah CO2 is just a copout. NOT that we should continue to pollute as we have!!
(May 16, 2012 at 1:40 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:Continuing to build on such disaster-prone land is irrational.
I agree, Oro. Of course, I make the same point every year when Oklahoma gets flattened by tornadoes.
Agreed Min...why do people do it? Why have they not designed better housing to accommodated the Yearly Tornadoes?? Just as stupid are those who lose everything in the Bushfires and stand there in-front of the TV camera stating "oh we are going to rebuild just like it was" WTF??
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 17, 2012 at 2:52 am
Quote:Agreed Min...why do people do it?
Stupidity? Lack of viable alternatives? Too much belief that their fairy tale god will protect them?
I don't know.
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 17, 2012 at 4:34 am
(This post was last modified: May 17, 2012 at 4:34 am by orogenicman.)
KichigaiNeko Wrote:What like reducing water vapour?? Which seems to be the primary culprit of GHG. nah CO2 is just a copout. NOT that we should continue to pollute as we have!!
You don't seriously believe that we can release billions of tons of CO2 (which, by the way, is almost always released in conjunction with those other polluting chemicals you were earlier agreeing needed to be dealth with) into the atmosphere year after year and see no response from the Earth? Surely you aren't suggesting that that is the case. Because, my friend, that would be rather naive.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
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RE: Climate catastrophe isn't so certain
May 18, 2012 at 2:15 am
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2012 at 2:20 am by KichigaiNeko.)
(May 17, 2012 at 4:34 am)orogenicman Wrote: KichigaiNeko Wrote:What like reducing water vapour?? Which seems to be the primary culprit of GHG. nah CO2 is just a copout. NOT that we should continue to pollute as we have!!
You don't seriously believe that we can release billions of tons of CO2 (which, by the way, is almost always released in conjunction with those other polluting chemicals you were earlier agreeing needed to be dealth with) into the atmosphere year after year and see no response from the Earth? Surely you aren't suggesting that that is the case. Because, my friend, that would be rather naive.
No I am suggesting that we clean up our mess. Targeting CO2 emissions seems the easiest and yet there are so many other emissions that contribute to GHG.
I would LOVE to see the North Pacific Garbage Dump cleaned up for starters. ![[Image: 8442843_orig.png]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.occupyforanimals.org%2Fuploads%2F7%2F7%2F3%2F5%2F7735203%2F8442843_orig.png) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacif...bage_Patch
![[Image: garbage-patch1.jpg]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=ascity.wpengine.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F11%2Fgarbage-patch1.jpg)
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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