Most Christians use whole tracts of the Old Testament to qualify their arguments about why gay marriage is immoral, mostly from the book of Leviticus. The problem is that when Jesus came around he formed something called the "New Covenant," which means that all that stuff about sacrificing goats and shit no longer apply. So, when you follow Old Testament laws, you're not being a good Christian, you're being a dirty, ultra-orthodox Jew.
If you followed Leviticus to a T, you're also expected to:

1: Not wear fabrics made with blended fibers (so no underwear with elastic waists)
2: Not shave your beard (I don't see a lot of Christians walking around with unshaven beards)
3: Two types of seed may not be planted in the same field. Too bad crop rotation is an essential part of modern farming.
4: Shellfish are right out too. Goodbye, lobster dinner.
5: No crossbreeding anything. Goodbye mules, as well as practically any seedless fruit.
6: Tattoos are not allowed.
7: Ditto is eating blood and fat. Goodbye rare steaks. Or, hell, any kind of burger or steak that isn't ridiculously, meticulously cut.
8: You can't has cheeseburger, either, because Leviticus also forbids mixing meat and dairy.

The New Testament argument against homosexuality is gleaned mostly from Paul's letter to the Corinthians. Paul's disclaimer at the beginning of this letter is that as long as you are a good Christian, the liturgy of laws he states from the Torah do not apply to you.
Jesus himself denied the ethical code laid down by Moses because they were written a couple thousand years before Jesus started his ministry and were thus totally out of date almost FOUR THOUSAND FUCKING YEARS AGO!
God might "hate fags" but Jesus doesn't mention homosexuality once in the Bible. If God was so pissed at the faggots then why the hell didn't he tell his son to tell his chosen people to keep their cocks away from each others bungholes?
When a Centurion asked Jesus to heal his gay lover, Jesus called him the most faithful man in Jerusalem...OK, well the term used for "gay lover" may be interpreted different ways, but-
We could dive into the actual language of the bible to prove him wrong, but this shit is already way waaaaay too fucking boring.

So, to all Christians, please, kindly, do us all a favor on the issue of gay marriage...and shut the fuck up. K? K. Your hypocrisy is difficult enough to deal with. You don't need to give me any more reasons to want to smack you in the face with a hot cast iron frying pan, much less a dozen or so of them all rolled into one.

Quote:The problem is that when Jesus came around he formed something called the "New Covenant," which means that all that stuff about sacrificing goats and shit no longer apply.

Depends on where you look in the big book of bullshit.

Quote:"Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets: I came not to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished" (Matthew 5:17-18).

Last I looked "heaven and earth" had not passed away.

Here is the real reason all religious people need to butt out of gay marriage: It's not a religious issue. This is an issue of the state, which is separate from church. Quite simply, religion has no place in marriage and, therefore, should have no say in it. I think voting on gay marriage is bullshit. It's not a matter that should be voted on, it's a matter of rights.

(May 17, 2012 at 8:08 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:The problem is that when Jesus came around he formed something called the "New Covenant," which means that all that stuff about sacrificing goats and shit no longer apply.

Depends on where you look in the big book of bullshit.

Quote:"Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets: I came not to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished" (Matthew 5:17-18).

Last I looked "heaven and earth" had not passed away.

Shhhh, Min, we're talking to the Christians here, remember they're a very simple-minded lot, going into the whole thing about contradictions makes their poor gullible credulous little brains hurt. ;D

I like to hurt their little brains.

Truth be told, this is a matter of appeal. Since the bible is so heavily contradictory with one gospel saying one thing and another saying the complete opposite on some very important points [like homosexuality for example], you have to appeal to the group that believe that Jesus basically said "get outta here with that outdated bool-sheeyit." My own opinion on Jesus' existence notwithstanding, nevertheless for the Christians who believe Jesus did away with the Old Testament [basically a large number of them] I appeal to them to stick to their guns and to basically realize what utter hypocrisy it is they believe otherwise.

We can worry about debunking the rest of their beliefs later, but, step by step, right?

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(May 17, 2012 at 8:13 pm)Annik Wrote: Here is the real reason all religious people need to butt out of gay marriage: It's not a religious issue. This is an issue of the state, which is separate from church. Quite simply, religion has no place in marriage and, therefore, should have no say in it. I think voting on gay marriage is bullshit. It's not a matter that should be voted on, it's a matter of rights.

I wholeheartedly agree, believe you me, but like I said to Min, it's a matter of appealing on this. We all agree that there's no moral issue at stake here [well...in the case that we all agree that gay marriage is NOT immoral, but there is definitely some serious moral issues with telling people attracted to certain kinds of people that they simply can't get married 'just because.'], but let's face it, when it comes to reasoning with the religious, you have to dumb it down sometimes and appeal to their own superstitions before you can get after the rest of it.

Actually beliefs against gay marriage come from Church tradition (the fact that for traditional Christianity marriage is about family and new life), and against [male] homosexuality come from the Pauline epistles.

OT law consists of both moral and cultural laws. If you actually read the OT you will note that all of it only applies to Jewish people. When Jesus fulfills the law, he expands it onto Gentiles, abolishing the culture-specific laws as well. This is why if you actually read the rest of Matthew 5, you can see him specifically picking at problems within said OT law.

Quote:When Jesus fulfills the law, he expands it onto Gentiles,

That's not what your non-existent godboy is alleged to have said.

How come if it is a church tradition that so many priests are butt-fucking little boys? You'd think that would be wrong too, no?

(May 17, 2012 at 11:38 pm)Aiza Wrote: OT law consists of both moral and cultural laws. If you actually read the OT you will note that all of it only applies to Jewish people. When Jesus fulfills the law, he expands it onto Gentiles, abolishing the culture-specific laws as well. This is why if you actually read the rest of Matthew 5, you can see him specifically picking at problems within said OT law.

And your point here would be what??? Your god is either exceptionally stupid or simply late to his own party.

(May 17, 2012 at 11:38 pm)Aiza Wrote: Actually beliefs against gay marriage come from Church tradition (the fact that for traditional Christianity marriage is about family and new life), and against [male] homosexuality come from the Pauline epistles.

First of all, appeal to tradition is a fallacy.

Secondly, as mentioned many times before, it's not about forcing churches to marry gay couples, it's about giving them the secular legal right to have equal status as partners, as hetero couples have. I say screw the gays that are believers and want to get married in church, some stupid faggots they be