Not that this would matter. No license no practice, period.

I believe the term you're looking for GC is "scapegoat", btw, but "perfect sacrifice" sounds a whole hell of alot nicer, I agree.

Quote:His healing record was perfect, so I doubt you will get anyone to complain.

Hey, if I was writing a fictional story my hero would always shit golden nuggets, too. Fiction is easy. You shouldn't believe it though.

Yes but then you'd be stuck with sophomoric fiction (just as the authors of the Jesus narrative were) by constant reference to dues ex machina. You know Horace warned agaist this in those authors own (supposed) lifetimes but they don't seem to have been big readers...meh.

(June 11, 2012 at 2:36 am)cratehorus Wrote:

(June 11, 2012 at 2:02 am)Drich Wrote: Maybe you should look to do your own research rather than seek out others work to tell you how to think.

Did a christian just tell ME not to let others tell me how to think, that made my day!

here some more contradictions for you to "refute"

Moral Precepts

24. Robbery commanded
Ex 3:21,22/ Ex 12:35,36
Robbery forbidden
Lev 19:13/ Ex 20:15
25. Lying approved and sanctioned
Josh 2:4-6/ James 2:25/ Ex 1:18-20/ 1 Kings 22:21,22
Lying forbidden
Ex 20:16/ Prov 12:22/ Rev 21:8
26. Hatred to the Edomite sanctioned
2 Kings 14:7,3
Hatred to the Edomite forbidden
Deut 23:7
27. Killing commanded
Ex 32:27
Killing forbidden
Ex 20:13
28. The blood-shedder must die
Gen 9:5,6
The blood-shedder must not die
Gen 4:15
29. The making of images forbidden
Ex 20:4
The making of images commanded
Ex 25:18,20
30. Slavery and oppression ordained
Gen 9:25/ Lev 25:45,46/ Joel 3:8
Slavery and oppression forbidden
Is 58:6/ Ex 22:21/ Ex 21:16/ Matt 23:10
31. Improvidence enjoyed
Matt 6:28,31,34/ Luke 6:30,35/ Luke 12:3
Improvidence condemned
1 Tim 5:8/ Prov 13:22
32. Anger approved
Eph 4:26
Anger disapproved
Eccl 7:9/ Prov 22:24/ James 1:20
33. Good works to be seen of men
Matt 5:16
Good works not to be seen of men
Matt 6:1
34. Judging of others forbidden
Matt 7:1,2
Judging of others approved
1 Cor 6:2-4/ 1 Cor 5:12
35. Christ taught non-resistance
Matt 5:39/ Matt 26:52
Christ taught and practiced physical resistance
Luke 22:36/ John 2:15
36. Christ warned his followers not to fear being killed
Luke 12:4
Christ himself avoided the Jews for fear of being killed
John 7:1
37. Public prayer sanctioned
1 Kings 8:22,54, 9:3
Public prayer disapproved
Matt 6:5,6
38. Importunity in prayer commended
Luke 18:5,7
Importunity in prayer condemned
Matt 6:7,8
39. The wearing of long hair by men sanctioned
Judg 13:5/ Num 6:5
The wearing of long hair by men condemned
1 Cor 11:14
40. Circumcision instituted
Gen 17:10
Circumcision condemned
Gal 5:2
41. The Sabbath instituted
Ex 20:8
The Sabbath repudiated
Is 1:13/ Rom 14:5/ Col 2:16
42. The Sabbath instituted because God rested on the seventh day
Ex 20:11
The Sabbath instituted because God brought the Israelites
out of Egypt
Deut 5:15
43. No work to be done on the Sabbath under penalty of death
Ex 31:15/ Num 15:32,36
Jesus Christ broke the Sabbath and justified his disciples in
the same
John 5:16/ Matt 12:1-3,5
44. Baptism commanded
Matt 28:19
Baptism not commanded
1 Cor 1:17,14
45. Every kind of animal allowed for food.
Gen 9:3/ 1 Cor 10:25/ Rom 14:14
Certain kinds of animals prohibited for food.
Deut 14:7,8
46. Taking of oaths sanctioned
Num 30:2/ Gen 21:23-24,31/ Gen 31:53/ Heb 6:13
Taking of oaths forbidden
Matt 5:34
47. Marriage approved
Gen 2:18/ Gen 1:28/ Matt 19:5/ Heb 13:4
Marriage disapproved
1 Cor 7:1/ 1 Cor 7:7,8
48. Freedom of divorce permitted
Deut 24:1/ Deut 21:10,11,14
Divorce restricted
Matt 5:32
49. Adultery forbidden
Ex 20:14/ Heb 13:4
Adultery allowed
Num 31:18/ Hos 1:2; 2:1-3
50. Marriage or cohabitation with a sister denounced
Deut 27:22/ Lev 20:17
Abraham married his sister and God blessed the union
Gen 20:11,12/ Gen 17:16
51. A man may marry his brother's widow
Deut 25:5
A man may not marry his brother's widow
Lev 20:21
52. Hatred to kindred enjoined
Luke 14:26
Hatred to kindred condemned
Eph 6:2/ Eph 5:25,29
53. Intoxicating beverages recommended
Prov 31:6,7/ 1 Tim 5:23/ Ps 104:15
Intoxicating beverages discountenanced
Prov 20:1/ Prov 23:31,32
54. It is our duty to obey our rulers, who are God's ministers
and punish evil doers only
Rom 13:1-3,6
It is not our duty to obey rulers, who sometimes punish the
good and receive unto themselves damnation therefor
Ex 1:17,20/ Dan 3:16,18/ Dan 6:9,7,10/ Acts 4:26,27/
Mark 12:38,39,40/ Luke 23:11,24,33,35
55. Women's rights denied
Gen 3:16/ 1 Tim 2:12/ 1 Cor 14:34/ 1 Pet 3:6
Women's rights affirmed
Judg 4:4,14,15/ Judg 5:7/ Acts 2:18/ Acts 21:9
56. Obedience to masters enjoined
Col 3:22,23/ 1 Pet 2:18
Obedience due to God only
Matt 4:10/ 1 Cor 7:23/ Matt 23:10
57. There is an unpardonable sin
Mark 3:29
There is not unpardonable sin
Acts 13:39

Show me that you can be responsiable with what you have been given thus far and I will help you look into the rest.

Hey everyone, this thread was suppose to be about sharing passages that you think are fallacies in the Bible. I've only seen maybe at the most four posts on topic. All this other information is very interesting but it doesn't seem to have anything to do with the purpose of this thread.

Sorry didn't mean to hijack your thread. Perhaps you could take the time and explain to cratehorus that supposed contradictions are not what you are talking about. I don't think it would be well received from me.

How about this:

Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.

This sounds to me like the fallacy of special pleading, not because jesus is pleading, but because their (Jews, Romans or both) ignorance is not fully considered in the argument regarding their future punishment for the act of crucifying the son of god.

Consideration: Why are they ignorant? Were god and jesus both inept at explaining the truth? The Jews and Romans had codified laws; however, they were to be subject to retribution for a non-codified law. For the christian out there that might want to claim that there is no retribution intended then why does jesus plead for their forgiveness?

I understand your interest, TEGH, but am unsure of your first premise, that finding fallacies in the bible has some utility, especially seeing the lack of utility in bible contradictions. There's always a way to recast things in order to reconcile them with a standard, a set of assumptions or a theory (this is an epistemological problem known as epistemological holism). And fallacies aren't any more immune to this simply because they are fallacies. I think of pad's example, and the thing which leaps to mind is some recent examples from social psychologist Jonathan Haidt in which human attitudes towards trust and betrayal don't follow the bare bones of human interaction laid out by game theory, such as the tit for tat strategy. So one could always argue that while some moral like "he who is without sin" doesn't embody a logical truth, it may embody a biological, social psychological truth that isn't apparent. Regardless of the persuasiveness of this example, the point is that there will always be one or more ways to rectify any problem a text possesses, at least apparently (and logically speaking, the ways are near infinite). (For another example Jewish legal tradition has a whole set of rationales for why David causing the death of Uriah was just; all it takes is imagination and practically, if not persuasively speaking, you can always make a sow's ear "look" like a silk purse.) So again, what do you hope to accomplish by identifying logical fallacies, and is your expectation realistic?

Quote:His healing record was perfect, so I doubt you will get anyone to complain.

Well yes, they are hardly going to include any failures.


trivia: miracle working by prophets is part of Jewish tradition. According to the Gospels, some people though Jesus was the prophet Jeremiah reborn.

Quote:Let’s briefly cover some historical background. The Roman emperor Vespasian ruled from A.D. 69 -79; his reign ended with his death. Writing about Vespasian some 25 years later, the Roman historian Tacitus reported a famous incident where Vespasian is said to have miraculously healed two men – one blind and one lame.

This miracle account is important because it has been frequently compared to the miracles of Jesus, and in particular, to his miraculous resurrection from the dead. The argument that skeptics make goes something like this: “The accounts of Vespasian’s healing miracles are as well evidenced as the resurrection of Jesus. People of the ancient world were credulous enough to believe both Vespasian’s miracles and Jesus’s miracles. However, sophisticated modern people do not believe that Vespasian actually healed the two men. Therefore, since the evidence for his miracles is at least as good as the evidence for Jesus’s reported resurrection, a sophisticated modern person should also not believe Jesus’s miraculous resurrection.”

I can hear the xtian shitwits...who insist that the Tacitus passages about their fucking christ are real will insist that these are phony.

http://www.toughquestionsanswered.org/20...elievable/

And, true to form, the special pleading begins quickly.