(September 8, 2009 at 2:35 pm)Saerules Wrote: Oh, i'd rather not, Kyu... But i do know a few people who might be interested... for a price

Kyu

(September 8, 2009 at 4:35 am)leo-rcc Wrote:

(September 8, 2009 at 3:12 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Let me demonstrate your reasoning:

1. The Devil is not a Christian
2. According to you, Christianity is: quote: "belief in God and Christ"
3. The Devil believes in God and Christ
4. The Devil is a Christian

Actually, you got 1 wrong, you start with a conclusion. According to EVF's definition the Devil is a Christian. Perfectly consistent.

ok

Is this any clearer?...

1. According to you (Evie), Christianity is: quote: "belief in God and Christ"
2. The Anti Christ believes in God and Christ
3. The Anti Christ is a Christian

Correct by that definition, yeah.

But by saying I don't understand what Christianity is when I argue with you about it, is implying NTS because I'm arguing with you about your views, so the basic definitions are shared amongst all Christians...by definition!

So to tell me I don't know what Christianity is, and for that to not be the NTS fallacy on your part is silly I think, because Christianity has so much variation in views, that the way you see it is a different matter entirely, and that's the issue here because the fundamentals are a whole lot more obvious, in terms of what they are and what cannot be disagreed on by other Christians, ever. What makes them Christian is belief in Christ and God, etc.

How would you judge to say that if they didn't believe in an afterlife then they weren't Christian, for example? How do you decide how many fundamentals are required to believe in for them to be a Christian, and where you draw the line between a fundamental and not a fundamental.

EvF

I've never met a "good" Christian. They all think they're good but their values suck. They think the values demonstrated by the biblical god are good and that's why they aspire to be just as screwed up as he is.
As a Christian, I can testify first hand just how evil Christianity made me. Change came when I decided my values would dictate my faith instead of allowing my faith to dictate my values. So, I made a list of what values I would aspire to and bingo... I found that I could no longer be a Christian. So, I repented and became an ethical freethinker.

@ Evie: Christians ALL agree on a certain version of the Nicene Creed (I'll link you when I find the right one). They may all have opinions on the detail, but the fundamental belief is universal.

Your definition fails because it entertains the notion that the Anti-Christ - obviously the furthest from Christian it would be possible to be, is actually a Christian. A contradiction.

I do not commit the NTS because your definition is too weak. Your definition is simply wrong.

(September 9, 2009 at 4:15 am)fr0d0 Wrote: @ Evie: Christians ALL agree on a certain version of the Nicene Creed (I'll link you when I find the right one). They may all have opinions on the detail, but the fundamental belief is universal.

Your definition fails because it entertains the notion that the Anti-Christ - obviously the furthest from Christian it would be possible to be, is actually a Christian. A contradiction.

I do not commit the NTS because your definition is too weak. Your definition is simply wrong.

I think you are giving people too much credit.
Mention the Nicene creed to most christians & they would probably look at you blankly.

Many people believe what they believe because their parents and grandparents believed and they do not know anything about the finer details.

They certainly would not about the rather dry commitee that decided the form church was to take.

This does not make them any less christian in my eyes.

Does it yours?

(September 9, 2009 at 2:17 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: Does it yours?

Completely & absolutely. That is precisely NOT Christianity, but second hand and irrelevant.

Would you accept that a Christian is defined (most plainly) as "a follower / devotee to the teachings and life of Jesus Christ"? The anti-Christ does not fall into this category, for it is the complete opposite of a follower of Jesus, both the man and the teachings.

Hehe, Jesus says that if you believe in him: you will go to heaven ^_^ Since Satan (a good man, i rather like him) believes in Jesus: he will go to heaven ^_^ Perfect christian hypocrisy ^_^

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@ Adrian, it doesn't matter that he isn't a Christian: he still goes to heaven.

(September 9, 2009 at 2:38 pm)Tiberius Wrote: Would you accept that a Christian is defined (most plainly) as "a follower / devotee to the teachings and life of Jesus Christ"? The anti-Christ does not fall into this category, for it is the complete opposite of a follower of Jesus, both the man and the teachings.

Yes I would

@ Saerules: YO CRAZY DUDE!