(September 3, 2012 at 12:36 am)Shell B Wrote: Casey, I love how in the same post you call the army gay ass and then go on to extol the virtues of infantry. You do realize that the army is mainly infantry, right? At any rate, what sort of U.S. soldier are you that denigrates other branches of the same military? Are you a soldier at all? If so, I'm thinking Marines. That is the only branch that promotes dickheadery as if it were a good quality.

Edit: Haha, read on and saw that you are in the Marines. How predictable. A soldier is a soldier. Don't be an elitist prick. I pay your salary.

No ma'am you don't. You haven't for a couple years now. And unless you were in the military yourself you would never understand why each service talks crap on all the others. And no a soldier is in the army, a sailor is in the navy(or Coast Guard), a marine is in the marine corps, and an airman is in the air force. They are all VERY different. There are different requirements, roles, mission types and many more things a regular civilian that isn't in some way directly related to the military (civilian contractor, government employee, or former service member) wouldn't fully grasp or even really have a need to.

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Whoever says the military is mostly infantry is out of their damned mind! A very small part (10-15%) is actualy infantry/ combat arms (thats everybody from attack helo pilots to combat engineers) the rest is support in the form of Maintenance, Supply, and Ordnance. Again, do not assume you know anything about the military if you aren't directly related to it in some way (as I said in my previous post) or have a source that is and isnt just blowing smoke out their rear.

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(September 3, 2012 at 2:01 am)Shell B Wrote:

(September 3, 2012 at 1:21 am)popeyespappy Wrote: The infantry makes up less than 10% of US Army forces.

There are at least 20 other branches of the United States Army. Unless quite a few of them make up a very small percentage of the Army, we are left with infantry making up the greatest percentage. Furthermore, it is 15%, not less than 10.

http://www.army.mil/article/45200/infant...d-demands/

The very first infantry unit in the United States was army. The very first fighting force we had was army. General George Washington was an army soldier. All of the stryker units you saw deployed in Iraq were army. Personally, I think every branch has its own merits, and I have nothing against Marines as a fighting force. I just think their attitude sucks. In my experience, Marines have a tendency to be brainwashed elitist knuckle draggers. I don't mean that as a blanket statement, as there are exceptions. However, I have never met an Army soldier as ball-grabbing and condescending as a Marine. It really isn't just my experience. They have different expectations as far as attitude.

You've never worked hand in hand with them have you? haha! I love hearing this stuff though for real. There are huge dicks in every service. (Meet an air force guy in the Security Forces... because the initials for it is SF they like to play like they're special forces... hilarious when real, Rangers, SEALs, Recon or anyone else strike them down.)

They are very different in training and use, but in role, they are all the same. You are/were part of the United States military. Also, a soldier is a soldier, whether you like it or not. You don't go redefining words because you want to think Marine has some distinction that other branches do not.

Yes, there are bad apples in every branch. Yes, there are respectful Marines. There is also no doubt whatsoever that Marines in general have attitude problems. Google "Why are Marines," but don't finish the phrase. You will come up with cocky and arrogant, at least. Once you have chosen your search term, you are likely to also come up with douchebags and assholes. I did. Reputation counts for a lot when you are an armed force. It's a damn shame that the Marines tend to only have a good reputation among themselves and with their family members. I mean, personality wise. Of course, they will be appreciated by those with a mind to appreciate soldiers. Yep, I said soldiers.

As for the percentage of infantry compared to other services, read my posts. You have to take into account that there are numerous MOS-es that do not have anything to do with infantry. 15-20 percent stacks up pretty fucking well against them. I also said Army, not military.

Was directly related. Lived on a joint Army/Air Force base for several years. I can also read and tell when someone is being a dick.

Just to be clear, a historian is likely to know more about the military than your average grunt. Fuck, I bet the rednecks dressed up like it's still the Civil War know more about the U.S. military than most people serving in it. That "You can't know about it, unless you're a part of it" is just more of that elitist shit. Sure, you were/are presumably in some armed force. Being in a house doesn't make you an architect, and an architect can know all about a house without ever setting foot in one.

You speak as if you are at least a civilian contractor. That usually means you are on contract with the U.S. government or your employers are. Fighting, driving trucks or both makes no difference. You, me and every other American is paying for it.

(September 3, 2012 at 3:54 am)Shell B Wrote: They are very different in training and use, but in role, they are all the same. You are/were part of the United States military. Also, a soldier is a soldier, whether you like it or not. You don't go redefining words because you want to think Marine has some distinction that other branches do not.

Yes, there are bad apples in every branch. Yes, there are respectful Marines. There is also no doubt whatsoever that Marines in general have attitude problems. Google "Why are Marines," but don't finish the phrase. You will come up with cocky and arrogant, at least. Once you have chosen your search term, you are likely to also come up with douchebags and assholes. I did. Reputation counts for a lot when you are an armed force. It's a damn shame that the Marines tend to only have a good reputation among themselves and with their family members. I mean, personality wise. Of course, they will be appreciated by those with a mind to appreciate soldiers. Yep, I said soldiers.

As for the percentage of infantry compared to other services, read my posts. You have to take into account that there are numerous MOS-es that do not have anything to do with infantry. 15-20 percent stacks up pretty fucking well against them. I also said Army, not military.

Was directly related. Lived on a joint Army/Air Force base for several years. I can also read and tell when someone is being a dick.

Just to be clear, a historian is likely to know more about the military than your average grunt. Fuck, I bet the rednecks dressed up like it's still the Civil War know more about the U.S. military than most people serving in it. That "You can't know about it, unless you're a part of it" is just more of that elitist shit. Sure, you were/are presumably in some armed force. Being in a house doesn't make you an architect, and an architect can know all about a house without ever setting foot in one.

You speak as if you are at least a civilian contractor. That usually means you are on contract with the U.S. government or your employers are. Fighting, driving trucks or both makes no difference. You, me and every other American is paying for it.

aww that's cute. One a soldier is in thge army (again) a soldier is a soldier and soldiers are in the army. Simple. That not my definition at all. Also, a grunt is infantry not any other form of combat arms. A historian may know the history of the military but have no damn clue how it operates. Hell, i just discovered today that the supply (or ordnance in the army) is highly confusing. Had to draw myself a picture and it was all sorts of jacked up. That came from a supply specialist or the recent new name logistician. Even he said that unless you deal with just that every day it's almost impossible to grasp and I don't doubt it. Like if I were to tell him how aviation maintenance works with our supply/logistics. He would probably have the same difficulty as I did. And as for the army specifically, an actual grunt (infantryman mind you) came into my shop to turn in some stuff. I asked him what he thought percentage wise compared to the other 270 some odd MOSs in the army. He agreed with you that they were the higher percentage of the army. The captain accompanying him disagreed and laid out exactly why that he was wrong and did verify the 10-15% combat arms average for MOSs. While non combat arms MOSs may have seen combat that does not make them grunts or infantry. They are affectionately named POGs (Personnel Other than Grunt). We established that yes I was a POG despite seeing combat first hand and losing some close friends. To continue in our now far off topic subject. It's pretty funny you assume that rednecks are the ones doing civil war reenactments while they try really hard to accurately portray the several jobs that went into the working military of the time it's pretty noticable they really only do calvary, infantry, and artillery. They dont go into the real nuts and bolts. Assume I'm being a dick if it makes you feel good, but in all honesty I may say gay ass army to any of the current or former soldiers around me and instead of getting butthurt like you did and try to insult me personally they'd say marines are gay or some other sexual orientated joke then we'd all laugh with a few 'fuck yous' thrown in. So don't care if you lived on a base thats not living and experiencing the life first hand. Please don't do that whole 'My husband is a first sergeant so I can act like I am one too' thing from him or your father being in the army. It doesn't help things. You can continue trying to one up all you'd like, but we really should continue this in another thread or get back on subject. Just let me know which.

And then you send me a pm apologizing for it. Yeah, we're done here.

Quote: Even still, cavalry is infantry now.

Granted, the terms have lost their original meaning.

Cavalry


Not Cavalry




Infantry



Not Infantry

(September 3, 2012 at 12:22 pm)Shell B Wrote: And then you send me a pm apologizing for it. Yeah, we're done here.

Wow, that's cute. Way to take the whole 'Hey my initial statement was out of line for the place it was posted' and act like I'm an asshole for admitting it. Good thing every else I posted was correct to anyone in any service.

The first is hilarious. The second is a stryker team. They are infantry in that they are trained to fight on the ground. Stryker units aren't really used to fight from the vehicles, though they can. They are a method of delivering infantry, so to speak. About eight guys hang out in the back. Once the truck reaches its destination, the back hatch there drops and they dismount. They are all infantry in every sense of the word, even the driver, though he stays with the truck. They just have a ride.

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(September 3, 2012 at 12:34 pm)CaseyTheAthie Wrote:

(September 3, 2012 at 12:22 pm)Shell B Wrote: And then you send me a pm apologizing for it. Yeah, we're done here.

Wow, that's cute. Way to take the whole 'Hey my initial statement was out of line for the place it was posted' and act like I'm an asshole for admitting it. Good thing every else I posted was correct to anyone in any service.

No, you're not. I read the PM first and then came in here for the wall of text and was like, "Aw, isn't being genuine overrated?" It's all right. This is one thread. I'm sure we'll agree and get along fine in another.

(September 3, 2012 at 12:30 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote: Even still, cavalry is infantry now.

Granted, the terms have lost their original meaning.

Cavalry


Not Cavalry




Infantry



Not Infantry

This is where you're Wrong minimalist. As for the last picture those are Mechanized INFANTRY. In the modern world there are infantrymen that DO NOT walk everywhere. Not to mention even in the link for the last picture it says the words MECHANIZED INFANTRY. As for cavalry, the helicopter which has replaced the horse, qualifies them for the cavalry status. Your pictures didn't prove anyone wrong. Sorry.

Cavalry is derived from the French word for horse...not helicopter.

Infantry has a much more obscure derivation - coming from the Italian for "boys."

So what ever we have corrupted the terms into now, their original historical meaning is cavalry = horsemen and infanty - foot soldiers.

Deal with it.

Quote:They are a method of delivering infantry, so to speak.

Yes, Shel. Just as the dragoons were mounted infantry who got to ride to a battle and then dismount. There is nothing new under the sun.

Well, yes, the dismounted part is infantry. If they are fighting on foot, they are infantry.