Apologetics was much more efficient in ancient times
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Apologetics was much more efficient in ancient times
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My ignore list
"The lord doesn't work in mysterious ways, but in ways that are indistinguishable from his nonexistence." -- George Yorgo Veenhuyzen quoted by John W. Loftus in The End of Christianity (p. 103).  RE: Apologetics was much more efficient in ancient times
September 13, 2012 at 4:27 pm
(This post was last modified: September 13, 2012 at 4:31 pm by Mystic.)
There was some straw-man but I get the gist of the message and I agree.
I think God and his glory is to be known through vision of the soul and will power is involved in that. And I think relying on an argument would take that spiritual element away from knowing God.  (September 13, 2012 at 4:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: There was some straw-man but I get the gist of the message and I agree. Hi, I'm just curious. What would your definition of God be?  (September 13, 2012 at 6:24 pm)greneknight Wrote: I'm just curious. What would your definition of God be? A true god would, first of all, not lower itself to the petty ramblings of human nature and second of all, it would be logically incoherent with existence. Therefore, god is a figment of a theist's imagination.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion. -- Superintendent Chalmers Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things. -- Ned Flanders Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral. -- The Rev Lovejoy  (September 13, 2012 at 4:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: There was some straw-man but I get the gist of the message and I agree. Define the following terms: God Soul Vision of the soul Spiritual element Make sure your definitions are coherent, in that they are; complete, not self contradictory, do not contradict reality, are based on something besides your feelings that they must be true. Why would a god insist that his/her/its existence could not be supported by reasoned argument? Why the need for 'spiritual vision'? You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence. (September 13, 2012 at 6:44 pm)IATIA Wrote:(September 13, 2012 at 6:24 pm)greneknight Wrote: I'm just curious. What would your definition of God be? A God doesn't seem to fit in logically with things. And if it's the God of the Bible, it's worse because of his gross immorality especially in the Old Testament. Even if he's a caring and loving God who isn't what the Bible cruelly portrays him to be, such a God can't be loving if we just look at the real world. So, for me, the best fit for God is as a metaphor for goodness. He doesn't exist as a being. He's the personification of goodness and a lot of art, sculpture, poetry and music have been created to express this metaphor of goodness. 
is their a non 6 min video, but a written version of this discussion?
(September 13, 2012 at 9:55 pm)Drich Wrote: is their a non 6 min video, but a written version of this discussion? This has the same basic argument http://jcnot4me.com/page71.html
My ignore list
"The lord doesn't work in mysterious ways, but in ways that are indistinguishable from his nonexistence." -- George Yorgo Veenhuyzen quoted by John W. Loftus in The End of Christianity (p. 103).
So because men of God in the current age do not perform signs and wonders, there is not proof of God? Is this the arguement?
If so, then maybe there was some event or some marker that divided that age from this one.. And maybe, God changed something that would allow direct access to Him on a personal level for each and every specific indivisual, rather than empowering one person every few generations to proove He is still kicking... 
That is a damn hilarious movie.
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Apologetics was much more efficient in ancient times
