(June 7, 2013 at 10:16 pm)Drich Wrote: Who you stop a person from stepping out in front of a bus every time?

Why? is it because it is a fore gone conclusion that all buses people step out in front of do not have brakes?

What happened to teaching a man to fish?

You do understand that to teach a man to fish you actually have to teach a man to fish, right? You don't just give a man a fishing pole and stand back while he casts and pierces his own ear in the process; there actually needs to be some instruction, some help. In the case of a man walking in front of a bus, the way you teach him not to walk in front of a bus is by stopping him from dying in a bus crash and imparting the knowledge that the action he just took leads to bus-death.

You don't let him get hit and then harangue the meat paste that used to be him about not stepping in front of buses.

(June 8, 2013 at 2:02 pm)Esquilax Wrote:

(June 7, 2013 at 10:16 pm)Drich Wrote: Who you stop a person from stepping out in front of a bus every time?

Why? is it because it is a fore gone conclusion that all buses people step out in front of do not have brakes?

What happened to teaching a man to fish?

You do understand that to teach a man to fish you actually have to teach a man to fish, right? You don't just give a man a fishing pole and stand back while he casts and pierces his own ear in the process; there actually needs to be some instruction, some help. In the case of a man walking in front of a bus, the way you teach him not to walk in front of a bus is by stopping him from dying in a bus crash and imparting the knowledge that the action he just took leads to bus-death.

You don't let him get hit and then harangue the meat paste that used to be him about not stepping in front of buses.

Agreed.

A person needs intention and understanding before performance. Just given a fishing rod, like You said, the person will act with a rod as they would with any stick. He/She needs a goal: obtain fish. They need the how: bait fish with the required tools. They need the why: fish are eaten as sustenance.

Now they have some outline as vague as it may seem, they can fish by trial.

This is indeed a very fishy story.

(June 8, 2013 at 4:38 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(June 7, 2013 at 10:16 pm)Drich Wrote: [
Deceiving spirits, are not about people imagine gods. It's about demons appearing before men/a man labeling him a prophet, filling him full of crap, and sending him out into the world to pull well meaning people from God. Joey smith, mo-hammy all 'prophets' of deceiving spirits.

And how do you know the same can't be said of your Jesus?

Promises and prophesies. The promises that the 'other gods' made are empty. The prophecies made by the other gods prophets have failed.

The bible says if one prophecy does not come true, that man is to be considered a false prophet. I have personally taken up the promises of the God of the bible and have looked into them and found them to be true.

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(June 8, 2013 at 1:56 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

Drich Wrote:Who you stop a person from stepping out in front of a bus every time?

Why? is it because it is a fore gone conclusion that all buses people step out in front of do not have brakes?

What happened to teaching a man to fish?

How are you going to teach him anything if he gets flattened by a bus? You do realize that when people die, they don't learn anything, don't you?

How do you know people get flattened by busses? Because you learned from someone else's mistake. That's how society works. We build and learn off of existing knowledge and the mistakes and successes of others.

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(June 8, 2013 at 2:02 pm)Esquilax Wrote:

(June 7, 2013 at 10:16 pm)Drich Wrote: Who you stop a person from stepping out in front of a bus every time?

Why? is it because it is a fore gone conclusion that all buses people step out in front of do not have brakes?

What happened to teaching a man to fish?

You do understand that to teach a man to fish you actually have to teach a man to fish, right? You don't just give a man a fishing pole and stand back while he casts and pierces his own ear in the process; there actually needs to be some instruction, some help. In the case of a man walking in front of a bus, the way you teach him not to walk in front of a bus is by stopping him from dying in a bus crash and imparting the knowledge that the action he just took leads to bus-death.

You don't let him get hit and then harangue the meat paste that used to be him about not stepping in front of buses.

I did not say that. You guys always seem to assume the worst.
I originally asked would you stop a man from stepping out in front of a bus each and every time? At some point you teach a man to look both ways before crossing, and you have to let them go. If he steps out in front of a bus and he is the one in a thousand that gets flattened then it is a reminder for everyone else in that society to look both ways before crossing the street.

(June 8, 2013 at 9:58 pm)Drich Wrote: I did not say that. You guys always seem to assume the worst.
I originally asked would you stop a man from stepping out in front of a bus each and every time?

Yup.

Quote:At some point you teach a man to look both ways before crossing, and you have to let them go.

Not if he's stepping out in front of a bus.

Quote:If he steps out in front of a bus and he is the one in a thousand that gets flattened then it is a reminder for everyone else in that society to look both ways before crossing the street.

No, it's just somebody who got hit by a bus.

Nobody needs to assume the worst Drich - you deliver.

(June 8, 2013 at 9:58 pm)Drich Wrote:

(June 8, 2013 at 4:38 am)Zen Badger Wrote: And how do you know the same can't be said of your Jesus?

Promises and prophesies. The promises that the 'other gods' made are empty. The prophecies made by the other gods prophets have failed.

The bible says if one prophecy does not come true, that man is to be considered a false prophet. I have personally taken up the promises of the God of the bible and have looked into them and found them to be true.

You didn't look very hard. These jesus promises aren't true:
And Jesus answered and said to them, “Truly I say to you, if you have faith and do not doubt, you will not only do what was done to the fig tree, but even if you say to this mountain, `Be taken up and cast into the sea,’ it will happen. “And all things you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive.” (Matthew 21:21-22 NAS)

Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks, receives; and the one who seeks, finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7-8 NAB)

Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst. (Matthew 18:19-20 NAS)

And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14 NAB)

If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. (John 15:7 NAB)

Mat(23:36) "All these things shall come upon this generation."
Jesus predicts the end of the world within the lifetime of his listeners.

Mark 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

John 1 1:51 "Ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man."
Jesus falsely prophesied that Nathaniel would see heaven open and angels descend upon Jesus. Nathaniel never saw it; neither has anyone else. (SAB)

Mat 26:64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. (SAB)

There are more verses of where jesus referred to non-existent scriptures and contradicted old testament scriptures.. but I think the point is well made.

Jesus was so false he wore false eyelashes!

(June 7, 2013 at 10:09 am)Drich Wrote: That aside we Worship God because we want to Love Him as a son would love a father. In your son father relationship do you only love your dad if he does what you will? What if your a strung out addict and need money for your next fix, but your father will not give it to you, does it mean he does not love you?

And what if you're the best son in the world, live as good as you can and meet righteous standards..and your father who loves you so much doesn't even bother showing up to your deathbed after a lifetime of faith based allowances that you've given him for not showing up your entire squalid, radically suffering life?

Quote:Death is only the unforgivable sin to those who worship and love THIS life above all else. We have been told that Ultimate love for This life some of us have, is reserved for God alone. If we Love God first, then we will have eternal life. If we love this life First what we have will be taken from us.

Seems like the cruelest thing someone could possibly do to me. If I get to death to find this is so, I will have no problems telling god he's Evil.
I find it ridiculous when I'm told that there are things on this earth we are tied to that we must give up. Why is there an automatic assumption that we are tied to anything different than you? When the same things (love for your spouse for instance) are lifted up as most righteous within your faith. What makes your love for yours any different than my love for mine? If anything, my love for mine is stronger because I put him first above all, not second behind god.

(June 8, 2013 at 10:34 pm)Brakeman Wrote: You didn't look very hard. These jesus promises aren't true:

Your right brake man I would have to look at Jesus' promises more than once to find a way to say they aren't true.

Quote: And Jesus answered and said to them, “Truly I say to you, if you have faith and do not doubt, you will not only do what was done to the fig tree, but even if you say to this mountain, `Be taken up and cast into the sea,’ it will happen. “And all things you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive.” (Matthew 21:21-22 NAS)

This is referred to as a metaphor. The Mountain Christ is speaking of is any insurmountable faith based obstical. Like the doubt some have that prevent them from belief.

Quote: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks, receives; and the one who seeks, finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7-8 NAB)

In luke this teaching is recorded in greater detail, what one thing specifically did Christ tell us to ask for in His name, Promising that we would receive it???

Remember Brake man the bible is not to be read in a vacuum. You have to reconcile all passages pertaining to a given message. If there is a teaching about Christ in Mat 7, and a very similar message telling us to A/S/K in Luke 11 then we must combine the two to have a complete contextual understanding.

Quote: Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst. (Matthew 18:19-20 NAS)

this is you just being slanderous. You omitted the qualifying verses that explain what you have cut and pasted out of context. try it in context:
18 “I can assure you that when you speak judgment here on earth, it will be God’s judgment. And when you promise forgiveness here on earth, it will be God’s forgiveness. 19 To say it another way, if two of you on earth agree on anything you pray for, my Father in heaven will do what you ask. 20 Yes, if two or three people are together believing in me, I am there with them.”

Quote: And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14 NAB)

Not a very honest person by nature are you?

Again context:
8 Philip said to him, “Lord, show us the Father. That is all we need.”

9 Jesus answered, “Philip, I have been with you for a long time. So you should know me. Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father too. So why do you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The things I have told you don’t come from me. The Father lives in me, and he is doing his own work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me. Or believe because of the miracles I have done.

12 “I can assure you that whoever believes in me will do the same things I have done. And they will do even greater things than I have done, because I am going to the Father. 13 And if you ask for anything in my name, I will do it for you. Then the Father’s glory will be shown through the Son. 14 If you ask me for anything in my name, I will do it.

Clearly Christ was making a promise to Phillip one of the one who did indeed perform the Miricals of Christ.

Quote: If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. (John 15:7 NAB)

are you starting to see a pattern yet?

15 Jesus said, “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch[a] of mine that does not produce fruit.[b] He also trims every branch that produces fruit to prepare it to produce even more. 3 You have already been prepared to produce more fruit by the teaching I have given you. 4 Stay joined to me and I will stay joined to you. No branch can produce fruit alone. It must stay connected to the vine. It is the same with you. You cannot produce fruit alone. You must stay joined to me.

5 “I am the vine, and you are the branches. If you stay joined to me, and I to you, you will produce plenty of fruit. But separated from me you won’t be able to do anything. 6 If you don’t stay joined to me, you will be like a branch that has been thrown out and has dried up. All the dead branches like that are gathered up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7 Stay joined together with me, and follow my teachings. If you do this, you can ask for anything you want, and it will be given to you. 8 Show that you are my followers by producing much fruit. This will bring honor[c] to my Father.

Christ does not give an open invitation to anyone who simply can chant a prayer. there is a condition He mentions like 1/2 a dozen times, care to guess what it is?

Quote:Mat(23:36) "All these things shall come upon this generation."
Jesus predicts the end of the world within the lifetime of his listeners.

Did you get this crap from a web site? Did you not even read it? http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea...ersion=ERV

Or was it your hope that I would not read your verses and put them back into context?

My question to you is given what was said prior to that verse, who are you to say none of those things happened to/or that generation of religious leaders wound up doing any of those things???

History seems to disagree with you on this one.

Quote:Mark 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

Christ is referring to the event recorded in Acts 2 with the out pouring of the Holy Spirit on to believers. Before that day people had to goto a place to worship God. After that Day God was literally poured out on the people/believers. (Your probably thinking of the second coming of Christ which would have made no sense at that point because Christ had not died yet/Resurected and assended yet.)

Quote:John 1 1:51 "Ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man."
Jesus falsely prophesied that Nathaniel would see heaven open and angels descend upon Jesus. Nathaniel never saw it; neither has anyone else. (SAB)

Now you are just making crap up. John 1 stops at verse 50.

Quote:Mat 26:64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. (SAB)

now lets try it in a dialect you can understand with proper context:
Again the high priest said to Jesus, “You are now under oath. I command you by the power of the living God to tell us the truth. Tell us, are you the Messiah, the Son of God?”

64 Jesus answered, “Yes, that’s right. But I tell you, in the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right side of God. And you will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven.”

How do you know the Head priest did not see these things?

Quote:There are more verses of where jesus referred to non-existent scriptures and contradicted old testament scriptures.. but I think the point is well made.

Jesus was so false he wore false eyelashes!

Your points like all your points crash and burn the moment you cut and paste them from their orginal format. But, if you want to cut and paste a few more I'm game.

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(June 8, 2013 at 10:53 pm)missluckie26 Wrote: And what if you're the best son in the world, live as good as you can and meet righteous standards..and your father who loves you so much doesn't even bother showing up to your deathbed after a lifetime of faith based allowances that you've given him for not showing up your entire squalid, radically suffering life?

But we are not good sons or daughters... Matter of fact most of us will not even admit we have a problem, and yet want our heavenly Father to enable us to live the lifestyle we want to live, by acknoweledging us and granting wishes when we ask them of Him.

Quote:Seems like the cruelest thing someone could possibly do to me. If I get to death to find this is so, I will have no problems telling god he's Evil.

I doubt that. for your eyes will be open to the self righteous standard you would have to use to judge God evil. (God is only evil if you use your own standard of good and evil.) To which begs the question what makes your self righteous standard have any value what so ever? What authority what power do you have to enact your want for good and evil?

Quote:I find it ridiculous when I'm told that there are things on this earth we are tied to that we must give up. Why is there an automatic assumption that we are tied to anything different than you? When the same things (love for your spouse for instance) are lifted up as most righteous within your faith. What makes your love for yours any different than my love for mine? If anything, my love for mine is stronger because I put him first above all, not second behind god.

When someone asks this question I think back to 80's role playing Games for the Orginal Nintendo system (bear with me)

When you first start out playing a game like dragon warrior or final fantasy you start with a character and character points or attribute point, which you can use to customize your character. For instance you guy has attribute catagories like Strength, Magic abilities, Stamina, Dexterity etc... And you are given a finite amount of Attribute points to accredit to your level 1 character. Usally it was just enough to give your guy 2 points in every category, or 10 character points in one category.

Now you ask How can I say my love for family be greater than your love for family if you put all of your character points into family first and I put my points in God first?

Quite simply put, God levels me up and my capacity for love is now greater than what I could love if I were to do it alone. Instead of maxing out at level 10. God has given me a level 40 love, (25 for Him and 15 for my family) that extended well beyond anything I could have ever thought possible. (As level 10 love was everyththing I thought possible before)

Quite literally I have God's love to give in addition to my own, and His love extends well beyond the point system I used to illustrate this precept.

To those who are faithful to what they have been given, they will be given more. God gives us "X" amount of love to give (as we all have limits on our love even if we say it is unconditional) If we give it all back what He gives in return far exceeds anything we can do on our own.

Quote:The prophecies made by the other gods prophets have failed.

Just like your phony god.

Quote:8 “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I will bring a sword against you and kill both man and beast. 9 Egypt will become a desolate wasteland. Then they will know that I am the Lord.

“‘Because you said, “The Nile is mine; I made it,” 10 therefore I am against you and against your streams, and I will make the land of Egypt a ruin and a desolate waste from Migdol to Aswan, as far as the border of Cush.[b] 11 The foot of neither man nor beast will pass through it; no one will live there for forty years. 12 I will make the land of Egypt desolate among devastated lands, and her cities will lie desolate forty years among ruined cities. And I will disperse the Egyptians among the nations and scatter them through the countries.

Ezeky 29

Total fucking bullshit. All of it.

Revelation is about 2,000 years late. How long until we write it off as failed?