(August 9, 2010 at 5:26 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: [quote='The_Flying_Skeptic' pid='85538' dateline='1281338657']
@Edward_The_Theist

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the color of the sky is something everyone agrees on. I understand why someone would walk away from a conversation with you if you asked them to prove the sky was blue: they probably thought you were crazy and walked away. you don't have to be a scientist to say that the sky is blue. What is the connection between being closed minded and accepting the consensus that the sky is blue?

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Quote:The point is not about the sky being blue. The point is about the concept of proof in general.

Your vague point is about how you don't think we should trust common sense, even when crosschecked by a 3rd party.

Quote:It's about atheists who go around proudly boasting that "science is the only truth!" When "Science" searches for whatever results ensure more grant money. Period. If you have the money, you can get the science.

that may be true for some things like when tobacco companies were probably paying off scientists to say that their product did not cause cancer (see Thank You For Smoking (film)), but you're wrong in saying that science doesn't continue to produce results that are beneficial to humankind.

Quote:You go around beating up on the Christian god, and it makes you look stupid. Of course that god doesn't exist. How long are atheists going to keep banging that drum? Until there's no Christian Church? Great, good luck with that. I criticize atheists for not having a definition of that which they don't believe in and you come across in response with a five-year-old's concrete cognition about the blue of the sky . And you still want me to think you're intellectual? You might as well be burning atheist prayer candles.

Are you serious: beating up the Christian god? what the fuck is that supposed to mean: "not having a definition of that which they don't believe in". are you trying to impress me or something because i'm not trying to be smart 'that which by what' you are trying to do? um, yeah, 5 year olds don't need there daddy's to tell them the sky is blue. I'm sure even 5 year olds can make the logical connection between the color 'blue' and the color of the sky as everyone else does. I'm sure you don't even know what you're talking about when you say 'concrete cognition'; so I don't care if you think i'm intellectual or not.

Quote:You say you don't believe in God. What pray tell is this God you don't believe in? Define it. I'll bet you can't. I'll be no one in here can. I'll be no one in here thinks past the concept of the Sunday School god when they think about that which they don't believe in.

i'll let you clarify on this one since the question didn't make any sense in English.

Quote:I've said it before; I'll say it agian, your intellect, anyone's intellect, is defined by that which they are superior to. If all you got is a disbelief in the Christian god and nothing in its place, you're just one notch up from the toothless hillbilly stompin-and-a-praisin in the First Church of the Third Revelation.

what if i believe the tooth fairy is superior to me? does this solve the problem? am i no longer a nerdy toothless hillbilly once I believe in the superior great all knowing pink elephant too? You make no sense dude. maybe you're just waaaay too smart for all of us.

Quote:Okay, the floor is yours (unless you're going to start challenging me about what floor, where floor, what do I mean...floor).

what is a floor? the floor is a word. the floor is a word... bird is a word i say the bird is a word! http://goo.gl/26KD

Common sense is an appeal to popularity; nothing more, nothing less. It is a fucking fallacy and the lamest argument for validity I know. Everyone on the planet should let go of that horrible concept and never speak of common sense as if it is even a meaningful term.

Thanks,
Rhizo

(August 9, 2010 at 10:01 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Common sense is an appeal to popularity; nothing more, nothing less. It is a fucking fallacy and the lamest argument for validity I know. Everyone on the planet should let go of that horrible concept and never speak of common sense as if it is even a meaningful term.

Thanks,
Rhizo

Well strictly speaking common sense is what the general populace believes through their senses to be true, in that respect it applies to pretty much every validated scientific theory. You can interpret it how you like, but so can everyone else

(August 9, 2010 at 5:16 pm)Edward the Theist Wrote: You say you don't believe in God. Fine. Then I have every right to ask you what God is and you should be able to say.

That makes no sense. I can't answer that question. No one can answer that question. That reason alone is why I'm an atheist in the first place. The very question is assinine.

(August 9, 2010 at 10:11 pm)ABierman1986 Wrote:

(August 9, 2010 at 10:01 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Common sense is an appeal to popularity; nothing more, nothing less. It is a fucking fallacy and the lamest argument for validity I know. Everyone on the planet should let go of that horrible concept and never speak of common sense as if it is even a meaningful term.

Thanks,
Rhizo

Well strictly speaking common sense is what the general populace believes through their senses to be true, in that respect it applies to pretty much every validated scientific theory. You can interpret it how you like, but so can everyone else

My experience is the most reliable thing about popular understanding of anything is that it's likely to be limited and wrong more often than not.

Popular views tend to be about a human generation behind academia.


The age of the polymorph autodidact is long gone.

(August 9, 2010 at 10:11 pm)ABierman1986 Wrote:

(August 9, 2010 at 10:01 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Common sense is an appeal to popularity; nothing more, nothing less. It is a fucking fallacy and the lamest argument for validity I know. Everyone on the planet should let go of that horrible concept and never speak of common sense as if it is even a meaningful term.

Thanks,
Rhizo

Well strictly speaking common sense is what the general populace believes through their senses to be true, in that respect it applies to pretty much every validated scientific theory. You can interpret it how you like, but so can everyone else

Dude, I get what you are saying but I hate that term so much! Even something as simple as the sky is blue is not common sense. In China the sky is grey most of the time, at night it is black, and to blind people there is no sky. Even if we were both staring at the same patch of sky that was apparently blue the fact is that it isn't any color at all but a trick of refraction that causes us to see it as blue. What value does the claim "common" add to any value or judgement? It is not the same as peer reviewed by the way; it simply means commonly held belief or commonly agreed upon idea. You know as well as I do that the phrase "common sense" has connotations relating to value judgements not just our sense organs.

Rhizo

Fair enough, I agree with you and try to not use the term, the connotation is one that offers no substance

(August 9, 2010 at 5:29 pm)Edward the Theist Wrote: Oh, so you're really anti-religious, not so much anti-God. Well, that's what I thought, but then I keep being told I don't understand atheists. I have a feeling if I said atheists don't believe in God, I'd be told I don't understand atheists.

We don't believe in god either, so yes, if you said "atheists don't believe in god" I would say that you'd be correct.

(August 9, 2010 at 5:29 pm)Edward the Theist Wrote: Well, this is what I think about it: Atheists like to say I don't understand atheism because it's their first line of defense. You can't hit a moving target, so just keep moving the definition of atheism around.

Atheists like to say you don't understand atheism because when you spout out 'facts' about atheism and the things you think we believe in, you're wrong.

Geez, it's like when creationists say that their junk science was rejected because of some far-fetched scientific community conspiracy against their whackjob theories when it's just that it's not science.
Edward, you've been citing your opinions on atheism, science, and the scientific community with numberous indications that you're been wrong on all counts.
We've only called you out on it either because you do not understand what we are saying or you refuse to try to undrestand what we are saying or both. So stop this persecution complex you seem to have because it's illogical.

(August 9, 2010 at 10:11 pm)ABierman1986 Wrote:

(August 9, 2010 at 10:01 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Common sense is an appeal to popularity; nothing more, nothing less. It is a fucking fallacy and the lamest argument for validity I know. Everyone on the planet should let go of that horrible concept and never speak of common sense as if it is even a meaningful term.

Thanks,
Rhizo

Well strictly speaking common sense is what the general populace believes through their senses to be true, in that respect it applies to pretty much every validated scientific theory. You can interpret it how you like, but so can everyone else

I'm with AB on this one. Most truths are very simple to comprehend. E=MC^2; very simple algebra. F=MA; even simpler. And these are the math formulas that explain vast amounts about our physical universe. So, I think there's something to be said for common sense.

But then I'm not cool, am I? So, there goes my credibility.

(August 10, 2010 at 12:40 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: I'm with AB on this one. Most truths are very simple to comprehend. E=MC^2; very simple algebra. F=MA; even simpler. And these are the math formulas that explain vast amounts about our physical universe. So, I think there's something to be said for common sense.

But then I'm not cool, am I? So, there goes my credibility.

Common sense is not a very reliable term any more than sprituality or god. There are so many interpretations and none that really add much value to the term. I am a common sense noncognitivist. I don't know you personally and wouldn't judge anything you say based on how I felt about you anyway. You have said some facepalmingly stupid things so far but so have I. Pay attention and you might learn something here; I know I have learned a lot. Any time the term "common sense" has been applied to an argument or "fact" I have cringed. There is very little that is common between human experiences and most of it doesn't really make much sense.

Rhizo