In response to Edward, i'll paste in a post I made yesterday on facebook.

The goal is humanism. Religion and atheism are a temporary conflict. Quite frankly I do not understand why this remains an issue, why we haven't outgrown these juvenile notions. Right now, all we see are white interests, democratic interests, american interests, fundamentalist interests, or atheist interests. All of these need to become human interests. The survival and prosperity of our species should be what we... put all of our efforts into. Once we enter space permanently, it should be a mad dash to colonize every hospitable moon and planet. Our survival should outweigh whatever inconsequential differences remaining between us. As Sagan said, this universe was not made for us. We are not special, we are entitled to nothing. We have survived thus far by pure mathematical chance, it will not last forever. We are an insignificant growth upon a planet and within a universe that will probably remain long after we are gone. We must survive them both. It is not our destiny, it is a human imparative. We must treat it as such.

Our "purpose" should be the purpose of every other species, the perpetuation of our species. It isn't all that divine, it isn't a purpose given to us by a supreme creator, it is the purpose of any sentient species. There have been several events that most certainly could have driven us to extinction, certainly during our early history, when our numbers dwindled down to mere thousands, and then beyond that, with the bubonic plague, world wars, imperialism, the nuclear age. We have survived most of these by pure chance, and it did not frighten us away. The thought of nuclear holocaust should have scared the shit out of every human being on this planet, but it did not. Those weapons still exist, people willing to use those weapons still exist. We have nuclear responses in place for every%

(August 9, 2010 at 5:16 pm)Edward the Theist Wrote: No, you're right. You don't have to define it to state you don't believe in it but that simply defines ignorance, doesn't it. Consider the statement: "God, I don't know what God is, but I don't believe in it." and compare it to, "God, I don't know what it is, but I believe in it." They both have the same level of ignorance associated with them.

You say you don't believe in God. Fine. Then I have every right to ask you what God is and you should be able to say.

It defines that you haven't defined god properly, end of. It's your shortcoming that you cannot make your case for god or gods Ed. Shifting the burden of proof over and over again is not going to make a convincing argument for your audience. We're done.

(August 10, 2010 at 7:05 am)SleepingDemon Wrote: In response to Edward, i'll paste in a post I made yesterday on facebook.

The goal is humanism. Religion and atheism are a temporary conflict. Quite frankly I do not understand why this remains an issue, why we haven't outgrown these juvenile notions. Right now, all we see are white interests, democratic interests, american interests, fundamentalist interests, or atheist interests. All of these need to become human interests. The survival and prosperity of our species should be what we... put all of our efforts into. Once we enter space permanently, it should be a mad dash to colonize every hospitable moon and planet. Our survival should outweigh whatever inconsequential differences remaining between us. As Sagan said, this universe was not made for us. We are not special, we are entitled to nothing. We have survived thus far by pure mathematical chance, it will not last forever. We are an insignificant growth upon a planet and within a universe that will probably remain long after we are gone. We must survive them both. It is not our destiny, it is a human imparative. We must treat it as such.

Our "purpose" should be the purpose of every other species, the perpetuation of our species. It isn't all that divine, it isn't a purpose given to us by a supreme creator, it is the purpose of any sentient species. There have been several events that most certainly could have driven us to extinction, certainly during our early history, when our numbers dwindled down to mere thousands, and then beyond that, with the bubonic plague, world wars, imperialism, the nuclear age. We have survived most of these by pure chance, and it did not frighten us away. The thought of nuclear holocaust should have scared the shit out of every human being on this planet, but it did not. Those weapons still exist, people willing to use those weapons still exist. We have nuclear responses in place for every%

In other words, "live to survive." I can't help it, I want more than that. But I like your opening sentence: The goal is humanism. I agree.

(August 10, 2010 at 12:02 pm)Edward the Theist Wrote: In other words, "live to survive." I can't help it, I want more than that. But I like your opening sentence: The goal is humanism. I agree.

But why stop at God's plan for your life? Supra-God has even better plans for your existence and Supra-Mega God has even better plans than those! Don't you really want to know the Supra-Mega purpose of your life and not just the "purpose"? It seems silly to stop at just knowing the mind of God now doesn't it?

Rhizo

(August 10, 2010 at 3:48 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: I don't like talking to you because you always use "we." You're like some cliquish jerk.

I use the term 'we' because you're talking about atheists in general in a manner not at all befitting our actual worldviews. You're deliberately misrepresenting not just me but all atheists and so I respond with correct assertions into the general view of atheists. As such, I'm not merely speaking for myself, but I'm speaking for many of those with a similar (atheistic) view of the world as I and many or most of the atheists both in this forum and in general.
Still, whether or not I come off a jerk is completely irrelevant to me. You haven't bothered to address any point that anyone has made and so far I have no reason to believe you've done anything other than come here to tell everyone what they believe and then make with some sort of persecution complex when everyone inevitably tells you that your views on us ("us" being atheists) are completely wrong.

(August 10, 2010 at 3:48 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: Whatdaya want to talke about.

I want you to discuss the points that I and others have made in response to some of your more assinine statements over the past several pages. Preferably point-by-point as though you're actually participating in a discussion rather than trying to preach your blatantly wrong views on what we (atheists) are and the science behind our more secular view of the world.

(August 10, 2010 at 3:48 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: See how you feel in a couple of days. I'm going to post a paper in Atheist Forums showing my evidence that consciousness is not from our brain. I think it's quite original.

I'm sure this will be entertaining.
If you honestly believe it to be evidence, then I have to ask if is a paper that has been scientifically peer-reviewed by people who study conciousness, the brain, and any other area of study where that 'evidence' would be highly influential if it had any chance of being an accurate view of conciousness.

(August 10, 2010 at 3:48 am)Edward the Theist Wrote: Until then, I'm just killing time and having some fun and giving as good as I get. If that's breaking the rules, by god then kick me out. Then you can be just like the Christian groups. You know what they do? Since they won't let any non-christians in, they post Hallmark-like religious images and write posts like, "Just hoping you have a blessed day!"

Probably because they tend to dislike people trolling their forums or making vague statements like how we're just like christians because the admins here might kick you out. Please.

Eddie baby does your 'paper' have anything to say on this.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10925841

The brain works like the internet.

Quote:I can't help it, I want more than that.

Yes....and right there you have the reason why religion exists. Humans who think they are so fucking special and superior have managed to convince themselves that they are SO FUCKING MARVELOUS that the world cannot possibly survive without them. Therefore we need all sorts of gods, souls, heavens, hells, saints, devils, etc., etc., to make them feel good about themselves.


All I can say Eddie is that you are going to be surprised as all when you die to find out that you are just fucking DEAD.

Like every other animal on earth.

Quote:All I can say Eddie is that you are going to be surprised as all when you die to find out that you are just fucking DEAD.

Would be nice if for just a few seconds they could see and experiance what being completely lifeless is like before falling into oblivion. Just so they can look back on all that they had claimed and say "fuck, I was wrong".

Then again, we kinda already know what it's like being dead. We have been dead for billions of years, can anyone remember anything before being born? Course not, because you didn't exist.
I think it would be kinda nice if for a few seconds, religious nuts could see what being dead is like. Big dark silence of oblivion.

(August 10, 2010 at 4:13 pm)Ace Wrote: I think it would be kinda nice if for a few seconds, religious nuts could see what being dead is like. Big dark silence of oblivion.

I think it would be nice if religious nuts could believe that you can have meaning and purpose in your life without relying on dead people and fiction novels.

Yeah... I guess theists aren't going to realize death is just that, the end. To me its all good and rest, just as late as possible