(January 27, 2015 at 8:40 pm)jackriot100 Wrote: so i am looking for a bit of advice from any atheist willing to help. i am 15 and i have really moronic parents who are christian. they think the country was founded on Christianity. they say things like "evolution is just a theory" and considering i aspire to be an evolutionary biologist this irritates me. i do not know what to do about it. i would say do nothing but i feel like i am lying to my parents by not informing them of my lack of belief. they refuse to listen to reason about all subjects involving religion. and example of this was when we talked about how most of the founding fathers were deistic not christian, which was a point i brought up about when trying to explain how we are a secular country founded by secular philosophies. i simply ask for advice coming from any helpful atheist. i do not mean to sound childish but considering circumstances i felt the need to put my trust in a forum of people who are hopefully not as stupid.

Tell them the definition of a theory.
Theory - a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained.

Also tell them there is also Christians who believe in evolution.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/06...32998.html

The the other thing tell them that the founding fathers weren't christians at all most where deist who wanted the nation secular.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/06...32998.html

Well one thing is ignorance is a powerful thing and well religion is to blame.
There is really now way to reason its like arguing with brick wall. But you can tell them if you wear mix fabrics your going to hell
because the bible says so.

Hey Jack,

There have been a bunch of posts from people who could say what I would say, only they say it better. I hope you find some peace and friendship here. And support. Dig in and get through school, vent here freely. I support you.

Welcome, Jack!

Heya Jack, welcome to the forum I'm sorry to hear about the problem with your parents. People have already given lots of good advice. I would come down on the side of either playing along until you can get out and become independent, or just saying you don't want to talk about religion with them. It's a matter of weighing up the benefits and costs of what you say, and how far you go. With the second option, you may be able to get away with this without having to outright state you're an atheist. Hopefully they would respect your request that religion not be discussed with you, at least.

I hope it works out for you. It's not fair that anyone has to put up with this crap from their parents. But sadly they have the power to make people's lives very difficult in response to things they don't want to hear.

It is a difficult situation, it must be hard to live at home and feel like you can't be yourself.
For now it might be best to just leave it, after all, is it really necessary to "come out"?

Of course, this does not mean that you have to agree with them on this subject, if they ask things of you that you are not comfortable with, you can always explain to them that you are not up for it. I don't know if they force you to go to church with them for example? Or if they expect you to do certain things based on religion.

I would say to make sure you have your arguments ready, and present them without screaming or name calling. Keep calm and explain to them why you disagree with something they expect of you. They are your parents, and I am sure they care about you. It is very difficult that they disagree, but screaming and name calling will certainly not make them listen to your or your arguments.

Of course, I do not know if any screaming/name calling is happening often, but it sounds like a situation where it occurs, or might occur. And I think it is a thing better prevented, for as far as it is in your hands. Dialogue is always better

1. Keep low profile
2. Get degree in biology
3. Profit!

Advice? Begin sentences with capital letters.

Seriously, as others have said, lay low and continue to learn. Be respectful of your parents. Unless there is more to the story, I'll assume they love you and are taking care of you to the best of their ability. You may have good reasons to disagree with them on any number of things, religious or otherwise, but don't let disagreement be the cause of any form of alienation; now or in the future. After emancipation, you will be on better footing for challenging their sincerely held beliefs without fear of any form of retribution.

I'm in a similar situation, but at least my parents believe in science along with their religious beliefs. I don't know how much help I am in this, but know your parents, be yourself, live your own life, and maybe develop some better grammar.

Most of the advice has already been given. If consequences would be severe, stay quiet and vent here. Keep your head down, get good grades, and get into a good university on scholarship so they can't hold your tuition hostage.

As far as challenging their views, I haven't seen anyone mention the Socratic Method - basically you have a conversation with your parents by asking them questions that challenge their preconceived ideas with the idea being that through answering your questions they think more deeply about their position and, if done strategically, talk themselves out of bad ideas. A quick example of this kind of thing would be:

Parent: "Evolution is just a theory!"
You: "What do you think in the meaning of the word "theory"?"
P: "Just some idea someone has that isn't proven."
Y: "Isn't gravity also a theory?"
P: "... No, it's a fact."
Y: "But isn't it called the Universal Theory of Gravitation?"
P: "... Well... I guess."
Y: "So if gravity is also a theory, does that mean it's just an idea that hasn't been proven?"
P: "... I think it's time for dinner."

Yeah, okay, stereotypical and probably not indicative of exactly the way a conversation like this would go with your parents, but you should get the idea. This would be a way to feel like you're not lying to your parents about not believing what they believe since you're just asking questions, and, if done in a slick-enough manner, not raising their hackles too much. This could also be a good information gathering technique for you to learn about which topics they've considered deeply and which they haven't, and which topics they're touchy about and which you can push them a little bit on.

Do you have a kindle or tablet or some other device you can download books on? I'd recommend A Manual for Creating Atheists by Peter Boghossian as a reference for employing the Socratic method, but just googling "Using the Socratic Method" these results were the first two results:

How to Argue Using the Socratic Method
http://www.wikihow.com/Argue-Using-the-Socratic-Method

Use the Socratic Method to Easily Win Arguments
http://lifehacker.com/5976891/use-the-so...-arguments

(The benefit of Boghossian's book is that he gives examples of instances where he's used the SM, both in longer discussions and in short "micro-innoculations" as he calls them.)

(January 27, 2015 at 8:40 pm)jackriot100 Wrote: so i am looking for a bit of advice from any atheist willing to help. i am 15 and i have really moronic parents who are christian. they think the country was founded on Christianity. they say things like "evolution is just a theory" and considering i aspire to be an evolutionary biologist this irritates me. i do not know what to do about it. i would say do nothing but i feel like i am lying to my parents by not informing them of my lack of belief. they refuse to listen to reason about all subjects involving religion. and example of this was when we talked about how most of the founding fathers were deistic not christian, which was a point i brought up about when trying to explain how we are a secular country founded by secular philosophies. i simply ask for advice coming from any helpful atheist. i do not mean to sound childish but considering circumstances i felt the need to put my trust in a forum of people who are hopefully not as stupid.

Well, i know its not what you want to hear, but the country was founded on Christian principles. Every school and college was Christian, you'd read from the Bible daily. Evolution is just a theory..

I recommend the first thing you do is atleast be honest to yourself and recognise that you do not have a "lack of belief", rather, you believe there is no God.