To the nearest gynecology ward!

(February 18, 2015 at 12:46 pm)KevinM1 Wrote:

(February 18, 2015 at 12:25 pm)YGninja Wrote: WHat didn't i reply to?

I think it was the only 'Church' being referred to. "The Church", is a colloquial term for the Christian authority, I don't think it is at all far fetched to suppose that at the time of writing, when referencing "The Church", they were exclusively referencing Christianity, especially as 99.9% of the population were Christian, and no other religion actually has churches. Can you give me an example of the term "The Church", being used to describe a Jewish congregation or Islamic congregation in that time period??

You're making the assertion. Burden of proof is on you.

The only claim i've made is that by "Church", they were most likely referring exclusively to the Christian Church, this is because Jews Have synagogues, Muslims have Mosques, other religions have temples, and the country was 99.9% Christian. I've fulfilled my BOP which is to explain why i think this is most likely. If you want to deny me, you inherit a BOP to explain why you think im wrong.

(February 18, 2015 at 1:45 pm)YGninja Wrote:

(February 18, 2015 at 12:46 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: You're making the assertion. Burden of proof is on you.

Ive made the claim that during the time period the only "Church" was the Christian Church, this is because Jews Have synagogues, Muslims have Mosques, other religions have temples. I've fulfilled my BOP. If you want to deny me, you inherit a BOP to show why i am wrong.

You're just arguing semantics. The founders, some of whom were deists, came from a country where people were killing each other over their beliefs. Just specifically meaning christianity would only solve part of this problem. Yes they used church, but if you want to solve the greater problem of murdering people due to religious beliefs, you have to include all religious beliefs. Otherwise you'd have christians killing people of other faiths, which wouldn't really be any different from catholics killing christians.

This is why you shouldn't cling to a narrow definition of "church". What's so much better about christians killing muslims, instead of christians killing other christians?

(February 18, 2015 at 1:45 pm)YGninja Wrote:

(February 18, 2015 at 12:46 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: You're making the assertion. Burden of proof is on you.

Ive made the claim that during the time period the only "Church" was the Christian Church, this is because Jews Have synagogues, Muslims have Mosques, other religions have temples. I've fulfilled my BOP. If you want to deny me, you inherit a BOP to show why i am wrong.

Wow I mean wow we've had some simple minded people here before but wow......

I can't even....

(February 18, 2015 at 1:51 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote:

(February 18, 2015 at 1:45 pm)YGninja Wrote: Ive made the claim that during the time period the only "Church" was the Christian Church, this is because Jews Have synagogues, Muslims have Mosques, other religions have temples. I've fulfilled my BOP. If you want to deny me, you inherit a BOP to show why i am wrong.

Wow I mean wow we've had some simple minded people here before but wow......

I can't even....

Thats great, because like fat and faithless, you've not yet come up with an argument, which i am sure would be your first response, if it were that easy.

Are you sure you're not "His_Majesty"?

(February 18, 2015 at 1:51 pm)Chad32 Wrote:

(February 18, 2015 at 1:45 pm)YGninja Wrote: Ive made the claim that during the time period the only "Church" was the Christian Church, this is because Jews Have synagogues, Muslims have Mosques, other religions have temples. I've fulfilled my BOP. If you want to deny me, you inherit a BOP to show why i am wrong.

You're just arguing semantics. The founders, some of whom were deists, came from a country where people were killing each other over their beliefs. Just specifically meaning christianity would only solve part of this problem. Yes they used church, but if you want to solve the greater problem of murdering people due to religious beliefs, you have to include all religious beliefs. Otherwise you'd have christians killing people of other faiths, which wouldn't really be any different from catholics killing christians.

This is why you shouldn't cling to a narrow definition of "church". What's so much better about christians killing muslims, instead of christians killing other christians?

Yup. Even if the Founders were truly only talking about the various Christian sects in their writing, the very fact that those same Constitutional protections have been applied to other faiths makes the point - even if it is true - moot.

Note that I'm not claiming his assertion is true. All YGNinja has done is make an assertion via terminology, with nothing (no exploration into other contemporary works of the time) to back it up.

It all goes back to his "The United States is a Christian nation" claim, which is based purely on a surface level reading (and misreading) of things. Moreover, it misses the point that even if America started off as a Christian nation (it didn't, but for argument's sake let's go with it), it's no longer one. That's because the Founders were smart enough to allow the Constitution to evolve over the course of time through the Amendment process, and because Supreme Court decisions have naturally (mostly) reflected the values of the people when they were made.

The whole thing is idiotic. This isn't a theocracy. Christianity holds social significance here, but not legal significance. There's a very wide difference between the two. And anyone claiming otherwise really needs to take a few history and political science courses.

(February 18, 2015 at 1:33 pm)Chad32 Wrote: To the nearest gynecology ward!

Good. You go study at the place with all the sick vaginas. I will go into the wild. And live amongst them.

Here, Ninja, I'll do your work for you. Scroll down to section 1.2. See the quote George Washington wrote to the nation's first established synagogue regarding this very matter?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_...separation

Was that so hard?

So, yes, the Founders meant to include other faiths in the First Amendment. It must hurt to always be wrong, huh?