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Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 4:52 pm
It turns out that Ken Ham wrote a long Facebook post attacking William Lane Craig how his embrace of evolution makes him not only a false Christian but harmful for people who listen to him and are fooled into being false Christians. Then Craig made a rebuttal video accusing Ham of the very same things. And then Paulogia edited it into a video like those two are having a conversation.
Perhaps the most bizarre part seems to me is at the 15-minute mark where Craig is asked if Jesus knew about the evolution and Craig said "no" saying that Jesus was not all-knowing.
But if Jesus did not know about something so important as to how life functions, like evolution, then why trust him about other stuff like an exorcism (because he obviously didn't know any better) and even the afterlife claims?
Perhaps it opens a whole Pandora's Box of questions: Why even think that book of Genesis was "only a metaphor" when you admit that writers of it obviously did not know any better?
Anyway, here's the video
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 5:11 pm
Ken Ham would lose a battle of wits with a slice of ham
"For the only way to eternal glory is a life lived in service of our Lord, FSM; Verily it is FSM who is the perfect being the name higher than all names, king of all kings and will bestow upon us all, one day, The great reclaiming" -The Prophet Boiardi-
Conservative trigger warning.
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 5:17 pm
(March 2, 2021 at 4:52 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: It turns out that Ken Ham wrote a long Facebook post attacking William Lane Craig how his embrace of evolution makes him not only a false Christian but harmful for people who listen to him and are fooled into being false Christians. Then Craig made a rebuttal video accusing Ham of the very same things. And then Paulogia edited it into a video like those two are having a conversation.
Perhaps the most bizarre part seems to me is at the 15-minute mark where Craig is asked if Jesus knew about the evolution and Craig said "no" saying that Jesus was not all-knowing.
But if Jesus did not know about something so important as to how life functions, like evolution, then why trust him about other stuff like an exorcism (because he obviously didn't know any better) and even the afterlife claims?
Perhaps it opens a whole Pandora's Box of questions: Why even think that book of Genesis was "only a metaphor" when you admit that writers of it obviously did not know any better?
Anyway, here's the video
TL;DW, but in regard to your question:
I’m not at all convinced that Jesus not being omniscient should have any bearing on his views about exorcism, an afterlife, or anything else. Why should it?
A neat parallel might be Immanuel Velikovksy. He had profound difficulty - verging on inability - to grasp the most elementary physics, astronomy, chemistry and mathematics, yet he was a successful physician and psychiatrist, and had a broad and deep knowledge of Hebrew literature.
It’s often been pointed out that expertise in one field doesn’t qualify you as an expert in another. I’d expand that to say ignorance of one subject doesn’t preclude you from being an authority in another.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 5:32 pm
(This post was last modified: March 2, 2021 at 5:35 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(March 2, 2021 at 4:52 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Perhaps the most bizarre part seems to me is at the 15-minute mark where Craig is asked if Jesus knew about the evolution and Craig said "no" saying that Jesus was not all-knowing.
But if Jesus did not know about something so important as to how life functions, like evolution, then why trust him about other stuff like an exorcism (because he obviously didn't know any better) and even the afterlife claims? Likely to be a consequence of how Craig interprets the Fully Human™ clause. Alot of the funnier stories (as apprehended by non-believers) and obvious narrative discontinuities boil down to the negotiation between proto-christian factions. Could jesus be fully human if he were omniscient? Could he be tempted? Would his sacrifice be worthy if he were merely human.....and could it be worthy if he were not human at all?
The answers they settled on are no, no, no, and no. They needed their god to be able to suffer so that it could pay for their sins with it's blood in a meaningful way - but it can't be so human that it's sacrifice would be dirty and unclean and insufficient like all the rest of the worms. It's not about explaining evolution or anything in thi life.. and it doesn't explain how the hereafter works either. It's all an answer to a single question that had to satisfy alot of peoples' superstitions.
Will this ticket get me through the door?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 5:47 pm
(This post was last modified: March 2, 2021 at 5:48 pm by onlinebiker.)
Kind of reminds me of Comicon dweebs arguing over Superman vs Batman kind of shit.
Just without the spiffy uniforms....
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 6:02 pm
(March 2, 2021 at 5:47 pm)onlinebiker Wrote: Kind of reminds me of Comicon dweebs arguing over Superman vs Batman kind of shit.
Just without the spiffy uniforms....
Puts me in mind of my favourite Comicon video, which I can’t be arsed to look for right now.
A rather stylish couple in evening clothes, wearing badges that say, ‘Mr. and Mrs. Wayne’ run up to everyone they can find who’s wearing a Batman costume, shriek ‘SON!’ then collapse on the floor.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 2, 2021 at 11:50 pm
(This post was last modified: March 2, 2021 at 11:51 pm by no one.)
Can we put them in a cage?
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 3, 2021 at 8:43 am
(This post was last modified: March 3, 2021 at 8:45 am by brewer.)
I do not like Craig's and Ham. I do not like them Sam I am.
I don't have an anger problem, I have an idiot problem.
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 3, 2021 at 9:08 am
If Ham were a Jew he'd still be wondering the desert, o wait, he still is avoiding logic.
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RE: Ham vs. Craig
March 3, 2021 at 9:35 am
(March 3, 2021 at 9:08 am)Brian37 Wrote: If Ham were a Jew he'd still be wondering the desert, o wait, he still is avoiding logic.
Ham can' t be Jewish......
Or lobster...
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